[nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals

Wed Sep 26 00:39:40 CDT 2007

Hi,
They can be scary for people with hearing loss too.
Thanks
Lauren
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chris & Judy Jones" <nfbwatac at earthlink.net>
To: "NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List" <nfbwatlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2007 9:05 AM
Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals


> Hi, Mike, and list,
>
> I  understand everything that's being said about audible traffic signals,
> but the main reason I don't trust them is the directionality can be skewed
> as noise bounces off of surrounding buildings.  I take the ones in 
> downtown
> Tacoma with a grain of salt for that very reason.  The echoes are almost 
> as
> loud as the signal itself.
>
> Judy
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com>
> To: "NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List" <nfbwatlk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 10:48 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals
>
>
>> Carl:
>>
>> I agree that traffic has become more perilous during the past forty
>> years -- if only because there are more of us (homo sapiens sapiens
>> can't seem to keep from procreating!).
>>
>> And I grant you that the aging process can cause us some difficulties.
>> But to my mind, this doesn't justify audible traffic signals for, shorn
>> of all extraneous reasoning, all justification for them amounts to
>> saying -- or at least implying -- that the signals make it safer to
>> travel. In essence, for example, this is what is implied (at least I
>> think so) when one says that audible signals help those who did not
>> receive good travel training. And, as I've previously said, to me, such
>> reasoning is not only bogus, but it is doubly in error because it
>> encourages belief in a falsehood. If audible signals actually prevented
>> vehicles from disobeying the traffic lights, I'd feel differently and
>> would whole-heartedly favor them. But since, in my view, they merely
>> offer a false sense of security -- even for those with few travel
>> skills -- then, again in my view, it is not a wise use of the taxpayers'
>> money to install them.
>>
>> I'll go further: both in NFB and in ACB, it is tacitly assumed that with
>> the proper devices (vibrotactile signals, for example), the deaf-blind
>> can be taught to travel safely. Yet this assumption embodies the same
>> false reasoning as is employed to justify audible traffic signals. I'm
>> sure that the deaf-blind (whether in NFB or ACB) will argue strenuously
>> with me but, in the end, I wonder whether it is truly safe for them to
>> travel independently. I'm not saying they shouldn't -- if a person
>> wishes to take his/her life in his/her hands, it's no business of mine.
>> But I worry that we are falsely raising hopes and expectations.
>>
>> How 'bout that for unorthodoxy? (grin)
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>  From: Carl Jarvis
>>  To: NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List
>>  Sent: Monday, September 24, 2007 8:59 PM
>>  Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic
>> signals
>>
>>
>>  Point well taken Mike,
>>  no one should be teaching folks that they are safer because traffic
>> signals
>>  emit some sort of noise.  I would never tell a student that they will
>> be
>>  safer when they learn to use a white travel cane.  I tell them that
>> they
>>  will be more efficient travelers.  But that cane will not protect them
>> from
>>  some stupid, drunk or reckless driver.
>>  Nor will the beeping, chirping, coo cooing signal.
>>  But properly placed it can be one more tool to assist us in an ever
>> more
>>  congested world.
>>  And with such innovations as roundabouts, quiet cars and idiot
>> drivers, we
>>  need all the help we can get.
>>  When I was a younger man, working in the Orientation and Training
>> Center, I
>>  traveled from home to work by public transit, and often I took
>> students into
>>  Seattle for one purpose or another.  My travel skills were about as
>> good as
>>  any totally blind persons, and better than many of my partially
>> sighted
>>  friends.
>>  But age plays tricks on us.  I now enjoy a condition called Meniere's
>>  disease of the ear.  My hearing has become somewhat distorted and my
>> balance
>>  is impacted, too.  Where I once could focus in on a sound, pinpointing
>> its
>>  exact position, now I'm lucky to hear it, and I'm never sure just
>> where it
>>  comes from.   Once upon a time, I must confess, that in my secret
>> heart of
>>  hearts, I thought other folks just weren't trying hard enough to learn
>> good
>>  travel skills.
>>  One thing I can say about the aging process.  It is very humbling.
>>  Once upon a time I was a fierce opponent of audible traffic signals.
>> I
>>  worked hard to get Seattle to take down the signal that rang out on
>> the
>>  corner of Rainier and South Alaska Street.  We even tried to get the
>> city to
>>  remove the signal at Walker and Rainier, where many multi-disabled
>> people
>>  crossed to work at the Lighthouse.
>>  Why, all they needed was to learn better travel skills.  We over
>> looked the
>>  fact that for many of these folks just riding the public transit and
>>  crossing that street was a major, heroic accomplishment.
>>  Finally, the sad fact is that the vast majority of folks in our blind
>>  community have received no travel training.  Since the government
>> can't seem
>>  to scrape up the money and staff to provide this training, then my
>> heart
>>  doesn't bleed a bit if they are pressured into spending 20 thousand
>> dollars
>>  to put in a noise maker in the corner traffic light.
>>  And finally, finally, that's like, PS and PPS, when I was young, every
>>  traffic signal in the city of Seattle rang each time the light
>> changed.
>>  There was no yellow light.  It went from green to red, with a loud
>> ring.
>>  There was a light on every corner rather than hanging from the center
>> of the
>>  street.  Also, there were no free right turns.
>>  Even in a driving rainstorm you could hear that signal ring.
>>  But as pedestrian's safety became second to the need to speed up
>> traffic,
>>  changes were made that actually put foot traffic in great peril.
>>
>>  Carl Jarvis
>>
>>
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>>  nfbwatlk at nfbnet.org
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>>
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