[nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals

[Robert Sellers]

Joanne,

A malfunctioning audible probably happens more then we realize.  I was
crossing at an intersection, which has an audible, and it signaled to cross
with a red light. Fortunately there was traffic to tune into.

Bob 
-----Original Message-----
From: nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Joanne Laurent
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 8:13 PM
To: 'NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals

I just pulled another student back from crossing on a red light at an
audible signal. This is a very regular occurrence for me. While I agree that
these signals have some very good uses, I continue to witness untrained
travelers interpret them improperly. These signals are downright dangerous
as they provide a false sense of security and many people who use them
without proper training tend to completely abandon all responsibility for
listening to traffic. 
    Please use audible signals cautiously. Consider them a helpful wake-up
call to alert you that it MAY BE your turn to cross. Always, always, always
listen for traffic before stepping off the curb, rather than using the
audible as your only or final decision making tool.  
   Additional concerns that I have about audible signals is they may be in a
state of disrepair (someone previously mentioned this) or are programmed to
give mixed or incorrect communication. For instance, the signal in Vancouver
at the corner of Reserve and Mill Plain provides the anticipated sound to
cross when the light is red. Pedestrians standing on the south side of Mill
Plain waiting to cross Reserve can hear the anticipated sound of their walk
signal when a pedestrian wishing to cross Reserve from the north side of
Mill Plain gets a walk signal. There is a left turn arrow at this
intersection so the pedestrian wishing to cross Reserve on the south side of
the street usually has a red light when the pedestrian on the north side has
a green light. The sound is the same to cross Reserve (east/west) no matter
which side of Mill Plain you are crossing from and it can be heard (and is
often incorrectly utilized) from the side with the red light. In theory
(traffic engineer theory, not mine) you should be able to localize the sound
source and determine which cuckoo or chirp belongs to your own side of the
street. In practice, however, the average human concentrating on a million
other things is not able to pick this subtle bit of information out of a
speaker. 
     I'll be off line for a couple of days so if a question comes to me that
I don't answer immediately I'm not ignoring you - I'm just gone! 

Joanne Laurent
Certified Orientation and Mobility Specialist
If you can't learn it, I'm not teaching it right!
www.blindcoach.com

Highest Expectations Travel and Adaptive Skills Instruction for the Blind
P.O. Box 586 Ariel, WA 98603
(360) 231-4597 


-----Original Message-----
From: nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Robert Sellers
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:09 AM
To: 'NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List'
Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals


Gary, I've been through that situation too. There are two  intersections
that I have found that an audible may be of a benefit. A T-intersection and
an intersection where  there is much traffic in one direction but not the
other. Even in those 2 intersections, it is  important to listen. 
My question is, if one begins to rely on the audible for crossing, what
happens when  he/she is at in intersection or in a strange city that has no
audibles. How independent can that  allow someone to be.  

My concern is, if we don't resolve the quiet car problem, when the quiet car
becomes the dominant vehicle on the street. It is not the audible that will
make it safe for us to cross the street. It won't be us hearing the car
first, we will be dependent on a driver to see us first!! That is a scary
thought. Thanks, but no thanks.  

Bob

-----Original Message-----
From: nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Mackenstadt, Gary
Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 2:23 PM
To: NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List
Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals

Hey, Noel.  I think you and I agree that audible street signals suck and are
totally unnecessary.  I will never understand the logic of them, although I
recognize that they are here to stay.  Somehow, the public believes that
audible street signals safeguard the crossing of blind people.  Today, I was
out downtown at Second and Spring.  I happened to be walking with someone.A
car ran the red light.  I had no trouble hearing it, but I could not help
but think those individuals, including some blind people, believe that
audible street signals are safe.  They are not.  No one, including the
sighted, should use the street signal to cross an intersection.  Listen for
the flow of traffic.  Audible street signals are another example of our path
to hell being paved with misguided thinking about the blind. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org]On
Behalf Of Nightingale, Noel
Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 12:44 PM
To: nfbwatlk at nfbnet.org
Subject: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals


NFB of Washington listers:

Earlier this week, I traveled in a different part of downtown Seattle
than the area of downtown I ordinarily traverse.  It was then that I
discovered that there are now audible pedestrian traffic signals at
least two intersections along Virginia Street.  I suspect they were put
in as a part of construction that is occurring in the area.

I found the audible signals to be less distracting than the ones I have
previously encountered.  The level of volume did not interfere with the
sound of traffic.  On the other hand, they seem to be at places that are
fairly straight forward crossings, as opposed to the five-way
intersection that is a block north at Olive street.

I'd be curious to hear of anyone else's experiences with respect to the
increased installation of audible traffic signals in their neck of the
woods.

Noel


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