[nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals

Wed Oct 10 22:54:32 CDT 2007

Hi, Joanne,

An excellent post.

Another thing I don't like about the audibles is that they can be placed in 
an area where its echo bounces off several buildings.  This is the case at 
the Tacoma downtown transit center.  That crosswalk is also in the middle of 
the block.  It's always easier to cross at the intersections and go on down 
to the bus lanes.

They've also installed a synthesized voice that announces Walk, Don't Walk, 
or Wait.  However, that voice is very quiet and has been in disrepair in the 
past.  Common sense and good travel skills are unbeatable.

Judy

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Joanne Laurent" <joanne at blindcoach.com>
To: "'NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List'" <nfbwatlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals

>I just pulled another student back from crossing on a red light at an
> audible signal. This is a very regular occurrence for me. While I agree 
> that
> these signals have some very good uses, I continue to witness untrained
> travelers interpret them improperly. These signals are downright dangerous
> as they provide a false sense of security and many people who use them
> without proper training tend to completely abandon all responsibility for
> listening to traffic.
>    Please use audible signals cautiously. Consider them a helpful wake-up
> call to alert you that it MAY BE your turn to cross. Always, always, 
> always
> listen for traffic before stepping off the curb, rather than using the
> audible as your only or final decision making tool.
>   Additional concerns that I have about audible signals is they may be in 
> a
> state of disrepair (someone previously mentioned this) or are programmed 
> to
> give mixed or incorrect communication. For instance, the signal in 
> Vancouver
> at the corner of Reserve and Mill Plain provides the anticipated sound to
> cross when the light is red. Pedestrians standing on the south side of 
> Mill
> Plain waiting to cross Reserve can hear the anticipated sound of their 
> walk
> signal when a pedestrian wishing to cross Reserve from the north side of
> Mill Plain gets a walk signal. There is a left turn arrow at this
> intersection so the pedestrian wishing to cross Reserve on the south side 
> of
> the street usually has a red light when the pedestrian on the north side 
> has
> a green light. The sound is the same to cross Reserve (east/west) no 
> matter
> which side of Mill Plain you are crossing from and it can be heard (and is
> often incorrectly utilized) from the side with the red light. In theory
> (traffic engineer theory, not mine) you should be able to localize the 
> sound
> source and determine which cuckoo or chirp belongs to your own side of the
> street. In practice, however, the average human concentrating on a million
> other things is not able to pick this subtle bit of information out of a
> speaker.
>     I'll be off line for a couple of days so if a question comes to me 
> that
> I don't answer immediately I'm not ignoring you - I'm just gone!
>
> Joanne Laurent
> Certified Orientation and Mobility Specialist
> If you can't learn it, I'm not teaching it right!
> www.blindcoach.com
>
> Highest Expectations Travel and Adaptive Skills Instruction for the Blind
> P.O. Box 586 Ariel, WA 98603
> (360) 231-4597
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Robert Sellers
> Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2007 12:09 AM
> To: 'NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals
>
>
> Gary, I've been through that situation too. There are two  intersections
> that I have found that an audible may be of a benefit. A T-intersection 
> and
> an intersection where  there is much traffic in one direction but not the
> other. Even in those 2 intersections, it is  important to listen.
> My question is, if one begins to rely on the audible for crossing, what
> happens when  he/she is at in intersection or in a strange city that has 
> no
> audibles. How independent can that  allow someone to be.
>
> My concern is, if we don't resolve the quiet car problem, when the quiet 
> car
> becomes the dominant vehicle on the street. It is not the audible that 
> will
> make it safe for us to cross the street. It won't be us hearing the car
> first, we will be dependent on a driver to see us first!! That is a scary
> thought. Thanks, but no thanks.
>
> Bob
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Mackenstadt, Gary
> Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 2:23 PM
> To: NFB of Washington Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals
>
> Hey, Noel.  I think you and I agree that audible street signals suck and 
> are
> totally unnecessary.  I will never understand the logic of them, although 
> I
> recognize that they are here to stay.  Somehow, the public believes that
> audible street signals safeguard the crossing of blind people.  Today, I 
> was
> out downtown at Second and Spring.  I happened to be walking with 
> someone.A
> car ran the red light.  I had no trouble hearing it, but I could not help
> but think those individuals, including some blind people, believe that
> audible street signals are safe.  They are not.  No one, including the
> sighted, should use the street signal to cross an intersection.  Listen 
> for
> the flow of traffic.  Audible street signals are another example of our 
> path
> to hell being paved with misguided thinking about the blind.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfbwatlk-bounces at nfbnet.org]On
> Behalf Of Nightingale, Noel
> Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 12:44 PM
> To: nfbwatlk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [nfbwatlk] Alert about increase in audible traffic signals
>
>
> NFB of Washington listers:
>
> Earlier this week, I traveled in a different part of downtown Seattle
> than the area of downtown I ordinarily traverse.  It was then that I
> discovered that there are now audible pedestrian traffic signals at
> least two intersections along Virginia Street.  I suspect they were put
> in as a part of construction that is occurring in the area.
>
> I found the audible signals to be less distracting than the ones I have
> previously encountered.  The level of volume did not interfere with the
> sound of traffic.  On the other hand, they seem to be at places that are
> fairly straight forward crossings, as opposed to the five-way
> intersection that is a block north at Olive street.
>
> I'd be curious to hear of anyone else's experiences with respect to the
> increased installation of audible traffic signals in their neck of the
> woods.
>
> Noel
>
>
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