[nfb-talk] independent voting and the blind

[Wm. Ritchhart]

I would also add that the states using the Auto-Mark are just as
susceptible to fraud.  All it takes is someone with access to blank
ballots and a #2 lead pencil.  I have said it over and over on this
list.  If the people running the election want to stuff the ballot box,
they can do it with paper.  It just requires a bit more work. 


William
 

-----Original Message-----
From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
On Behalf Of T. Joseph Carter
Sent: Friday, February 01, 2008 3:46 AM
To: NFB Talk Mailing List
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] independent voting and the blind

Ray,

Of course we know who complained about the machines.  We'll probably
argue
against at least half of the list about the reasons why they complained
about the machines.  That said, election security is basically a joke
all
around, and both parties know it.  The notion of one eligible,
registered
voter and one vote sounds good in principle.  Reality is more
interesting.

We'd be amazed by how many dead people cast their ballot apparently from
beyond the grave, for example.  Even once it's determined (usually after
the election) that these dead people voted, the anonymous ballot makes
it
impossible to determine for whom they voted.  Once the ballot is turned
in, it's counted.  Unless it isn't.

So until we have a reasonable and comprehensive way to eliminate all of
the other forms of election fraud which actively take place, I don't
want
to hear that we, the blind, cannot have a simple, confidential, and
anonymous ballot because some halfwitted bureaucrat sees conspiracies to
keep HIS candidate from winning lurking around every corner.  The
AutoMark
in particular is a great machine and it works well.

We have the right to vote, just the same as anyone else.  And we have
the
right to vote in the same manner and with the same protections as
everyone
else.  Congress even did something useful for once and passed laws
mandating that we be given the rights so long denied us.  We should not
give an inch on this issue.

Joseph,
Mad as hell that we still haven't won this one


On Thu, Jan 31, 2008 at 08:27:58PM -0600, Ray Foret jr wrote:
> First, note the change in subject line.
> Ah, Bill, well, that settles my mind a little.  You see, the reports
on the 
> ever trust-worthy media (yeah right) led me to believe that the
machines 
> were going away entirely.  Somebody once told me that before the
machines, 
> Braille ballots were used.  They were used in such a way that a
sightie 
> could determine what markings had been made for what choices.  This,
so I 
> seem to recall, was in Lincoln Nebraska.  I won't say, but, I have my
own 
> particular ideas of who complained about the new electronic machines;
and, 
> those of y'all on this list who know me well can figure that out as
y'all 
> will.  My point of concern was and still remains that the blind of
Florida 
> will no longer have a way to vote INDEPENDENTLY and privately.  Now,
it may 
> seem a strange thing for a blind person from Louisiana to be concerned
about 
> the situation in Florida; but, you see, it's really very simple.  What

> effects some of us effects us all; whether directly or indirectly.  Am
I 
> right in guessing that there are other states where this same concern
has 
> seemed to raise its head?
> 
> Sincerely yours,
> The Constantly Barefooted,
> Ray
> Home phone and fax:
> (985)360-3375
> E-mail:
> rforetjratcomcastdotnet
> Skype Name:
> barefootedray
> 
> God bless President George W. Bush!
> God bless our troops!
> and God bless America
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Bill Outman" <woutman at earthlink.net>
> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 4:26 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] speakers
> 
> 
> Hi, Ray and all.
> 
> Here's a few thoughts on this issue.
> 
> What's happening here in Florida is a new requirement for a paper
trail on
> the machines is taking effect.  By the way the change of the
presidential
> primary date was tacked on to that bill and that resulted in the
issues over
> counting of party delegates.  But that's another story.
> 
> I can't speak to the entire state but here in Volusia County this
means the
> Diebolt machines will go away which were  being used for early voting
and
> accessible voting.  We'll be going to the AutoMark device which has
> accessible features but prints out the ballot which can then be run
through
> the optical scan machines.
> 
> Theoretically then we should still be able to vote independently but
it
> means we and the poll workers will again have to learn new devices and
the
> prior investment in the Diebolt units will have been wasted.  Another
fine
> example of your tax dollars at work because some people were paranoid
about
> election security.
> 
> Best wishes.
> 
> Bill Outman
> Secretary, Greater Daytona Beach Chapter
> National Federation of the Blind
> 
> 
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