[nfb-talk] My Thoughts, state con attendance
Sherri
flmom2006 at gmail.com
Tue Nov 13 08:45:23 CST 2007
Thanks for your thought-provoking message David. I had forgotten that
various groups were banned from joining the ACB at one time.
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Evans" <drevans at bellsouth.net>
To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 5:51 PM
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] My Thoughts, state con attendance
Dear Sherri,
Many Blind people do not know that the split that formed the NFB and ACB
came about due to a number of factors. There was the stand that the NFB
took on equal wages for Blind workers in sheltered shops that were opposed
by the major shop operators like the AFB and The Lighthouses and state
operated shops at the time.
Then there was the coming of the Civil Rights movement in the 60"s which
brought race and religion into the mix.
The sheltered shops operators saw the NFB as a threat to their theifdoms and
even tried to get the NFB banned as a Communist organization in the late
50"s and 60"s. Then when the NFB came out and proclaimed that it would be an
equal opportunity organization and welcome Blacks and Jews as members and
give them the right to serve on Boards of Directors throughout the
organization, it caused an uprising among White members in many states, but
mostly in the South, where things were still very segregated.
These discontented members tried to vote they views and lost and then walked
out of the National Convention and down the street to another hotel and
started the ACB with allot of money from the sheltered shop interest. The
sheltered shop operators saw the ACB as a wedge they could use to prevent
the NFB from overturning their cash cow and losing the millions they were
making on the backs of Blind workers.
They have been separate organizations ever since.
For many years, the ACB banned Blacks and Jews from becoming members and
even attending their meetings.
This was still the way it was until the late 70"s and 80"s, in many places.
The NFB took the high road and welcomed Blacks and Jews to become members
and tried to concentrate on the positive and what was the best for Blind
People.
The NFB has been opposed, on many fronts, such as NFB NEWSLINE Services and
getting repeal of the 1935 law that lets sheltered workshop operators pay
less than minimum wage to blind workers when at the same time they are
required to pay it to other disabled workers that may be less productive
than they are.
To be fair, the ACB has changed some and there are some good people in it
too. It now lets Blacks and Jews join, but it still is locked in this
bitterness toward everything NFB and that NFB does.
The ACB has some good things that the NFB could learn from and follow I
think. Such things as the ACB Radio Project. I would like to see us web
streaming the NFB philosophy to the Nation and the World.
I think that we should be doing more to export our philosophy, worldwide,
than we do.
Maybe a Blind version of the Peace Corps to help many developing countries.
This would be a great place for some grants I bet.
Anyway, I try to keep my opinions on this to a minimum because there is
enough bashing being done by others.
It is too bad that an easy to read version is not out there to explain it
all to the younger people who were not around when it all happened. It is
easy to misjudge something taken out of context, right?
David Evans, NFBF
NFB means:" Never Forget the Blind!"
-----Original Message-----
From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Sherri
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 7:07 PM
To: NFB Talk Mailing List
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] My Thoughts, state con attendance
I think it's terrific that you have certain things easier, but by no means
do you have all things easier. The unemployment rate is the same or higher
than when I joined in 1979. Discrimination is still practiced.
I cannot say that I 100% agree with the entire NFB structure and I too have
a difficult time determining what the constitution means by "conduct
unbecoming a Federationist. I too think that it would be great were we to
have one organization. And remember, it used to be that way until the
faction that formed the ACB felt it was necessary to have two organizations.
The NFB, and partly because of its structure, has done more to change the
lives of blind people than any other advocacy organization, but we have a
long way to go.
Sherri
----- Original Message -----
From: "Milissa Garside" <milissa.g79 at gmail.com>
To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 6:21 PM
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] My Thoughts, state con attendance
Hello All,
I have been reading this thread and have some thoughts to add.
With respect to convention attendance, as many have already said, I think
younger people are less likely to attend because there are many other things
occupying our time. As a result, it is also difficult for younger people to
connect with other younger people at a convention. Like Mike has said,
joining a civil rights organization does not hold the appeal that it once
did.
As a relatively younger blind person, (I am 28) I grew up in Massachusetts
where there is a big ACB population. Growing up, I knew nothing about the
NFB or the ACB. I never knew they existed until I was about 16. Since
Massachusetts is such a big ACB State, I naturally was introduced to the ACB
first. Although I first learned about the ACB when I was 16, I never really
got involved until I was 23. During my time in ACB, I heard nothing but bad
things about the NFB. At first, I took what was said at face value and
accepted that the NFB was "the dark side." As I heard more and more bad
things about the NFB, I decided to investigate it for myself.
Upon learning more about the NFB, I was impressed with the philosophy which
I unknowingly already had. I just didn't know that it was the philosophy
that the NFB prides itself on. As I talked to my local NFB president, I
began to realize how much my personal beliefs were truly in line with the
NFB philosophy. For a brief time, I was heavily involved with my local NFB
chapter and enjoyed it.
All that said however, I am currently not a member of either organization.
While I strongly believe in the NFB philosophy, I do not agree with the
current structure of the leadership. I take issue with some parts of the NFB
constitution. Such as the provision whereby a person can be expelled from
the NFB based upon miss conduct. In the constitution, there is not a
definition of what "miss conduct" is. As a result, "miss conduct" is widely
open for interpretation and is subject to a whole myriad of unknown reasons
why a person may be expelled from the NFB. In that regard, the NFB does not
fully engage in a democratic structure. By no means am I invalidating all
the great things that the NFB has and still does accomplish. As a very
political person, I just find it hard to be a member of an organization
where I find faults with the guiding document of the organization.
With respect to the organization split, I do not believe that there should
be two national organizations. Currently, I am reading "People of Vision",
the book on the history of the ACB. Upon finishing this book, I am going to
read "marching Alone and Walking Together" to obtain a full and complete
understanding why many were expelled and chose to leave the NFB. I am going
to reserve full judgment and comments of what happened until I have read
both books. But, I feel that having two apposing organizations hinders the
blind in many capacities.
Something that I have experienced which is a huge turn off as a younger
person is being told by "older" people in both organizations that as a
younger person, I know nothing about fighting for my rights and advocating
for myself and that because of all the technology, I have it so much easier.
While it is true that in terms of technology, we do have it much easier, the
reason we have it easier is a result of all the people who worked hard and
advocated for our rights and for accessible technology. However, its these
same people who seem to be bitter that we have it so much easier in terms of
technology. In terms of advocating, we younger people still have to advocate
for ourselves. Just because the laws are now in place and there is
technology, does not mean that everything falls into place. I have had to
advocate for myself since I was a freshman in high school and all through
college. I have had to do it and do it well. Although we do not have to
advocate to change or implement new laws, younger people have to fight and
advocate for the laws to be used as they should be.
Another issue I often come across is that simply because I am blind, that I
need to be apart of one of the organizations to keep up the good fight.
While I believe that we all need to educate and keep up the good fight, I do
not believe that one needs to be apart of an organization to be successful
in this endeavor. I am an independent thinker and find faults with both
organizations. While there are positive things about each organization, I
believe that the NFB does the most good for the blind community as a whole.
That said however, I can not sacrifice my misgivings about the NFB
constitution and be a member.
As a blind person that does not belong to either organization, I am able to
effectively advocate for myself and others. I also believe that the NFB can
be very helpful to me in terms of befriending other like minded people and
learning many things along the way. For example, I am planning on going to
the Colorado Center for the Blind in January for some brush up independent
living training. If I ever need assistance, I know that the NFB is a strong
organization of blind people who might be able to help me. I think we can
all fight the good fight in our own way in our own corner of the world and
if we choose to fight the good fight outside of an organization, that is ok
too.
sometimes older blind people think that we younger people are ungrateful and
don't fully appreciate all that has been done to enable blind people to live
independently . I can't speak for all younger people but, I am very grateful
to all the blind people who have come before me, who have fought hard and
who have made it possible for me to live the type of life I am able to live
today. I am grateful to the blind people who have sacrificed many things in
order for me to have the rights I have today as a blind person. I thank all
those who have come before me and made the fight a little easier for me. I
don't forget that without the hard and persistent work of the NFB, blind
people would not be where we are today.
These are simply some of my thoughts. I am not writing them down to cause
mayhem. I am interested in creating dialogue and sparking some good thinking
on this list.
Milissa
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com>
To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] state con attendance
> Chris:
>
> With great respeect, I think you have not just a chip but a whole forest
> on your shoulder as regards volunteers at convention. NFB has them also
> but they are very unobtrusive and only help when asked and, frankly,
> don't help in areas wherein blind persons should be able to do for
> themselves. Lest you think I'm being preachy, I'm thinking of what
> happened at a recent WCB (Washington Council of the Blind -- WCB)
> convention wherein convention-goers who came on a WCB bus were told to
> put labels on their bags so that volunteers could find their bags for
> them (no thought that the passengers would find their own bags) and also
> there were volunteers to unpack and repack the bags of convention-goers.
> I'm sorry but that's plumb ridiculous.
>
> I agree with you that such things as appliance access are looming large
> in the inaccessibility department. But ACB is no more equipped to solve
> that problem than are we in NFB. Everyone may talk a good line about how
> wonderful "universal access" is but it ain't gonna happen. Why? Because
> manufacturers and, by extension, the general public, aren't going to pay
> for it. There are many more sighted persons than there are blind
> persons.
>
> Eventually, litigation may make a difference -- that's where your
> lawsuit and ours come into the picture. But there's a lot of case law to
> be made before such suits can be made effective.
>
> Moreover, when we worry about equal access, what do we really mean? How
> do we specify it legally? And do we mean access for the tech-savvy or
> for those who haven't a clue insofar as computer use are concerned.
> Accessibility, at least in terms of software, is a moving target and
> probably always be about two steps ahead of us. But we must keep on
> fighting. But we must act intelligently and not go off half-cocked. Just
> claiming, as ACB often does, that if the sighted have it, the blind
> ought to also won't cut it because, in the end, the only way that can
> happen is for all blind persons to regain their sight which won't
> happen. What we must strive for is access that's "good enough" -- that
> allows us to compete.
>
> By writing the foregoing, I am not minimizing your concerns; I tend to
> share them although I think the solutions aren't as simple as many of us
> would like them to be. So we're not so far apart on these matters as I
> may sound.
>
> However, I am going to challenge you a bit on the convention bit and
> about NFB governance. Mostly, what I here from you is "can't can't can't
> can't". Have you talked with your local chapter about getting a national
> convention scholarship? How about Robert Stigel, your affiliate
> President? And, believe me, there's a lot for state affiliates to do;
> the national leadership cannot handle a majority of what NFB does. So
> have you run for local office? How about state office? How many projects
> have you volunteered for in the last six months for your local chapter
> president? How about for the state affiliate?
>
> In other words, the NFB really is all of us. Quit complaining about how
> you are de facto being excluded ang get in there and pitch! WE need you
> and you need us!
>
> And get that block of wood off your shoulder! (broad smile)
>
> Mike
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Chris Westbrook
> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
> Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 2:36 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] state con attendance
>
>
> Mike, you make some good points. Being a young blind person myself, I
> think
> it's sad that many younger blind people view progress as inevitable
> and feel
> no need to join an organization. On the other hand, I'm not really
> sure
> what NFB is really doing to stop the tide from turning against us The
> biggest issue I see looming ahead is a loss of access to information.
> This
> could be due to inaccessible computer software, inaccessible
> appliances, or
> any number of other things I haven't thought of. On the inaccessible
> appliances front, we had a home showcase at convention, but do you
> really
> think that will make a difference? I'm sure most manufacturers really
> don't
> care whether their products were coincidentally sort of accessible. I
> hope
> our NFB Jernigan Institute can eventually help with this area. That
> leads
> me to my next point, which is what mike said about some people
> believing
> that the national leadership are the experts. I see the NFB as a very
> top
> down organization with much of it's activity happening at the national
> level. I wonder if in the future the NFB will become more and more
> focused
> on it's Jernigan institute and basically be a clearinghouse for
> research and
> product design, while the ACB does most of the advocacy work? I know
> for
> myself I really don't see that many ways for a rank and file member to
> influence policy, especially if they can't come to convention but even
> if
> they can.
>
> Also, I really think people in NFB need to relax and realize that not
> every
> blind person has had great training or has the ability to do
> everything
> independently. I know ACB has been criticized for having volunteers
> at
> their convention, and frankly I find that kind of amusing when NFB's
> leadership always has someone going sighted guide with them. IF it's
> good
> enough for the leadership, why is it not good enough for the general
> membership? If you don't want the help, just refuse it, but don't
> keep
> someone like me from using help that we may need. On another note, I
> frankly think ACB is better equipped to handle the challenges of the
> future.
> Yes, they can be a bit more demanding than necessary, but I think we
> as
> blind people are going to have to do more and more of that as time
> goes on.
> NFB's philosophy is too focused on always being independence and this
> whole
> idea of blindness being a nuisance and not that big of a deal. I'm
> afraid
> the NFB will suddenly wake up one day when all microwaves and other
> appliances are flat paneled with no way to use them effectively, there
> are
> no usable telephones, all keyboards are completely touch screen and
> wonder,
> gee how did we get here? I think I may be exaggerating slightly, but
> I
> don't think I'm exaggerating as much as some may think. My only
> consolation
> is that when things start getting worse, we will wake up and disregard
> what
> Kenneth Jernigan said in his speech "the day after civil rights"
> whenever
> that is, and start fighting again. I just hope it's not too late.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com>
> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 2:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] state con attendance
>
>
> > Ray:
> >
> > Welcome to the way the "other half" lives. Here in Washington, we
> > consider we're doing an outstanding job if we get seventy-five to
> eighty
> > people at our state banquet. Unlike at national conventions, our
> > banquets are more well attended than are our plenary convention
> sessions
> > as some convention participants bring guests to the banquet who do
> not
> > attend the rest of the convention.
> >
> > Of course, part of the problem here in Washington is that, whether
> we
> > admit it or not, we're still suffering from the organizational split
> > that accompanied the whole Robert Acosta business in the late 1970's
> > when the then-affiliate for Washington was expelled (or chose to
> leave,
> > depending upon one's viewpoint) and was reorganized. The old
> affiliate
> > eventually joined ACB so that ACB is considerably larger numerically
> > than is NFB in Washington. In the legislature, however, it is we of
> NFB
> > who are known for getting things done.
> >
> > AFfiliates east of the Mississippi such as Massachusetts are far
> larger
> > than are our affiliates out here with the exception of California.
> WE
> > are, in Shakespeare's terms, "we happy few". But NFB is where the
> action
> > is.
> >
> > On the original subject, what I see in terms of dwindling convention
> > attendance and grousing about the irrelevance of convention material
> > stems, I believe, from a number of trends in society today. First,
> > society is, in general, much more fragmented than was the case
> thirty or
> > forty years ago. People move around the country much more often than
> > heretofore and, hence, don't put down roots and make as many lasting
> > local friendships. (When was the last time you attended a "block
> > party"?) They are thus less likely to have great circles of
> friends --
> > arguably a prerequisit for easy growth of organizations.
> >
> > Second, perhaps because society is more fragmented and because there
> are
> > more venues of entertainment (cable TV, the Internet, video games
> and
> > the like), I believe that people are far less likely to be "joiners"
> > then was the case even twenty years ago. There are too many other
> things
> > competing for their time.
> >
> > Third, I believe that it is fair to say that the 1960's and 1970's
> were
> > decades of activism. Whatever your thoughts are concerning the war
> in
> > Iraq, note the vast difference between the small anti-war
> demonstrations
> > of today and the mass protests against the Vietnam war from 1964 to
> > 1975. WE of NFB, like many other activist organizations, are the
> victims
> > of the paradigm shift from activism to indifference and (see above)
> from
> > the paradigm of working to make changes to being entertained.
> >
> > Fourth, I believe that, rightly or wrongly, many young blind people
> > today see all the progress that the blind have made over the
> previous
> > two generations toward a world of equality with the sighted and
> conclude
> > that continued progress in this arena is inevitable. Obviously, I
> > disagree with this assessment and, in fact, I am worried that we
> might
> > be on the verge of slipping backward, making NFB even more of a
> > necessity than it may have been twenty years ago. Couple this with
> laws
> > mandating provision of services such as DSS offices at universities
> and
> > this is a recipe for organizational lacitude IMO. I opine that many
> > young people do not recognize that provision of some of these
> services
> > constitutes a wolf in sheep's clothing and, hence, when they hit the
> > "real world" and encounter businesses that don't automatically
> provide
> > them with all the high-tech gadgetry they think they need, they
> > interpret the problem as one of discrmination rather than one simply
> of
> > the way the world works. All this is to say that many blind people
> of
> > all ages today don't see why they need to gain advocacy skills or
> pay
> > attention to all the "dull" stuf involving politics or their
> agencies
> > for the blind. Let "the experts" do it. And while many would agree
> with
> > us that agency moguls may not be the "experts", some are beginning
> to
> > see *us* as the "experts",where by "us" I mean NFB leadership. In
> other
> > words, I'm not sure that the rank-and-file always sees that it has a
> > stake in what's happening or that it really has the power to change
> > things.
> >
> > This problem is not unique to NFB: ACB has it also. The "advantage",
> if
> > one wishes to call it that, that ACB has is that often its
> affiliates
> > conduct many more social functions than do NFB affiliates -- at
> least
> > it's like that out here in the Pacific Northwest. When, for example,
> was
> > the last time you attended a NFB affiliate convention where a
> comedian
> > was the featured banquet speaker? It has happend in ACB affiliates
> out
> > here.
> >
> > Now I would hazard that this sort of fluff is not what we in NFB
> truly
> > want. But to make changes, we must understand why what we're doing
> may
> > not always appeal to "the masses" and, therefore, must decide
> whether we
> > can incorporate other items into our conventions that might gain
> > interest and not cause groans of "same ol' same ol'" while at the
> same
> > time not betraying our NFB heritage and philosophy.
> >
> > I don't have the answer but I value the discussions as we may
> > collectively come up with ideas that might work for all of us.
> >
> > Mike Freeman, President
> > NFB of Washington
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Ray Foret Jr
> > To: NFB Talk Mailing List
> > Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 9:37 AM
> > Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] state con attendance
> >
> >
> > Edd, I am floored!!! Are you truly telling us that at your last
> New
> > Hampshire state NFB convention, y'all only had 30 attendees? Only
> 30?
> > What
> > is y'all's membership compared to that number? I just cannot get
> my
> > mind
> > around the idea of y'all putting all that work in to an all day
> state
> > convention and having only 30 people there. Perhaps you might
> inquire
> > of
> > your members just what the issues are which cause them not to
> attend
> > y'all's
> > convention. From what I gather, you say in your message that folks
> > were
> > complaining that the program items were "so so". If I'm not
> mistaken,
> > we
> > usually have over 100 folks at the Louisiana NFB state convention.
> > How
> > about I forward your message on to Pam Allan and she can maybe
> suggest
> > what
> > you might want to consider.
> >
> > Sincerely yours,
> > The Constantly Barefooted,
> > Ray
> > Home phone and fax:
> > (985)853-0139
> > E-mail:
> > rforetjratbellsouthdotnet
> > Skype Name:
> > barefootedray
> > Blog:
> > www.raysworld.blogs.com
> > Podcast .rss Feed:
> > http://feeds.feedburner.com/worldofray
> >
> > God bless President George W. Bush!
> > God bless our troops!
> > and God bless America
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Ed Meskys" <edmeskys at localnet.com>
> > To: "nfb-talk" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> > Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 10:44 AM
> > Subject: [nfb-talk] state con attendance
> >
> >
> > When I first became NH state president in 1988 the first few state
> > conventions I put on had about 100-120 attendees, up about 20% from
> > the
> > previous president, because I did a lot of outreach to find former
> and
> > new
> > members, and initiated a state newsletter. We had been drifting
> down
> > ever
> > since, to under 50. Last year we had our 50th anniversary, and got
> > more
> > attendees, but with people muttering about our programs being the
> > "same old,
> > same old." This year we decided to devote our whole morning to a
> topic
> > important to blind persons and many others in a rural state, the
> > future of
> > transportation in NH. We made it a one-day con, with a luncheon
> > banquet, and
> > the National report, some technology, mobility, and our business
> > meeting in
> > he afternoon. With the help of Blind Services, the talking book
> > library, the
> > Governor's Commission on Disabilities, and Granite State
> Independent
> > Living
> > (Foundation) we distributed over 2000 flyers, and aside from
> program
> > participants we had only 30 attendees. Our officers are very
> > disappointed,
> > and are saying it cost so much money to put on and advertise the
> con,
> > and
> > put in so much work, that we will pull back and only have a
> business
> > meeting
> > with lunch in the back room of a restaurant next year. Are other
> > states
> > having the same problem getting attendance at a con?
> >
> > We are using an Imagination Grant to put on a one-day tech expo
> next
> > April,
> > which is not a convention (cons are normally in October or
> November).
> > If
> > this flops too, I think the board will be devastated. We lined up
> an
> > excellent panel of five experts and administrators for the
> > transportation
> > panel, and are working on getting excellent speakers for the tech
> > expo.
> >
> > Incidentally, the results of our state elections were:
> > continuing constitutional officers:
> > Marie Johnson, President
> > Gil Vickery, FVP.
> > Judy Leavitt, SVP
> > Ed Meskys, secretary
> > Lucille Lynch, treasurer
> > and our new slate of untitled board positions is:
> > Julie Clark (new)
> > Wayne Harvey (new)
> > Donald Little (new)
> > John Parker (returning)
> > Stephen Yerardi (returning)
> >
> > Best, Ed Meskys
> >
> >
> > Edmund R. Meskys
> > NIEKAS Publications
> > National Federation of the Blind of N.H.
> > Moultonboro Lions Club
> > edmeskys at localnet.com
> > 322 Whittier Hwy
> > Moultonboro NH 03254-3627
> > my credo:
> > Clinton lied, nothing happened
> > Bush lied, thousands died
> > and over 3,000 permanently brain injured
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nfb-talk mailing list
> > nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nfb-talk mailing list
> > nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >
> >
> >
> > __________ NOD32 2651 (20071110) Information __________
> >
> > This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> > http://www.eset.com
> >
>
>
>
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