[nfb-talk] bionic eye

Sun Feb 18 10:34:45 CST 2007

If a plate is a dish of light I might accidentally set my hot cup of coffee on my favorite CD! ha,ha,ha,ha,ha What would I do without the great experience of stumbling? ha, ha, ha, ah, ah But I do like technology.

Mark Feliz
National Federation of the Blind of Arizona
East Valley Chapter President
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Subject:
nfb-talk Digest, Vol 9, Issue 38
Date:
Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:47:16 -0600
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>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Blind Photographer (David Andrews)
> 2. Re: Blind Photographer (David Andrews)
> 3. Bionic Eye (RyanO)
> 4. Re: Bionic Eye (Aaron Cannon)
> 5. READING JAWS/WITH EYES (Wm. Ritchhart)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 22:48:33 -0600
>From: David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com>
>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
>To: Laura Eaves <leaves1 at carolina.rr.com>, NFB Talk Mailing List
> <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070216224748.04472290 at visi.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>If you do a straight reply to the list, that is the way it is set up on this end. If it does differently, then your mail program must be doing something. Probably a Microsoft program, snicker.)
>
>Dave
>
>At 03:22 PM 2/12/2007, you wrote:
> >Hi all -- I see this mail didn't get to the list, although I intended it
> >to -- what is the defined behavior of this list when you reply to a message?
> >It seems like sometimes it goes to the sender and sometimes to the list.
> >Cheers.
> >--le
> >******* original message ******
> >Well, perhaps if you are the victim it would be a little hard, but if you
> >overhear something going down then it might be useful... I was just thinking
> >of a person on an unnamed list who is blind and who had a family member
> >attacked in the home -- her elderly and incoherent mother -- and when the
> >police came, even though the woman had been injured, since she was
> >incoherent and the daughter was blind, they just apologized and said they
> >could do nothing as there was no credible witness.
> >Quite sad and very frustrating.
> >--le
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Chris Westbrook" <
> >westbc at clw19.com>
> >To: "Laura Eaves" <
> >leaves1 at carolina.rr.com
> >>; "NFB Talk Mailing List"
> ><nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 5:38 PM
> >Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >
> >Only problem with that is, if a crime is being committed against you, the
> >last thing you'll be thinking about is that bloody camera!!
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Laura Eaves" <
> >leaves1 at carolina.rr.com>
> >To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 4:58 PM
> >Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >
> >> Hey all, one very important application of a camera for a blind person I
> >> would think would be to photograph an accident or a crime in progress to
> >> have a photo handy to identify the perpetrator.
> >>
> >> I have often heard of crimes committed against blind persons where the
> >> perpetrator gets away with it because there is no "eye witness". Well, if
> >> there's a picture the problem is solved.
> >> So put the "date stamp" on on your cell phone camera and keep it handy for
> >> emergency use in case you have the opportunity to use it!
> >>
> >> Just a thought.
> >> --le
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "kaye zimpher" <
> >kayezimpher at bellsouth.net>
> >> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >> Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2007 11:29 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >>
> >>
> >> To me, it is just one more thing that we are capable of doing that some of
> >> us did not know we could do and that the world definitely does not know we
> >> can do. I don't think it goes much beond that.
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Alan Wheeler" <
> >awheeler at neb.rr.com>
> >> To: <
> >william.ritchhart at sbcglobal.net
> >>; "'NFB Talk Mailing List'"
> >> <
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >> Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2007 10:39 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >>
> >>
> >>> Yeah, it shows that, but it doesn't, as this "shows something about the
> >>> blind" would imply, expose our soul or our inner selves to the world.
> >>> That
> >>> is what I was getting at.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From:
> >nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
> > [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> >>> Behalf Of Wm. Ritchhart
> >>> Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2007 8:07 AM
> >>> To: 'NFB Talk Mailing List'
> >>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >>>
> >>> Yes it does show something! A blind photographer can take just as crummy
> >>> or
> >>> just as good a picture as the average sighted person.
> >>>
> >>> I really cannot see the big deal. Today for the most part, you point the
> >>> camera at the target and push the button. What is the big deal
> >>> about that?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> William
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From:
> >nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
> > [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
> >>> On Behalf Of Alan Wheeler
> >>> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 9:42 PM
> >>> To: 'NFB Talk Mailing List'
> >>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >>>
> >>> Actually? I wouldn't put too much into this whole idea of photographs
> >>> showing the viewer something about the blind person who took the photows.
> >>> Sounds like (pardon my language) artsy-fartsy talk for saying that
> >>> artistic
> >>> expression is an expression of a person's soul. Not that I
> >>> wholeheartedly
> >>> agree with that, but that is what I think those people are trying to say
> >>> when they say that the photos show them something about being blind.
> >>> LOL!
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From:
> >nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
> > [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
> >>> On
> >>> Behalf Of Brian Miller
> >>> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 8:37 PM
> >>> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
> >>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >>>
> >>> I certainly think there is nothing wrong with wanting to understand how
> >>> photography works, take pictures, or have pictures taken of you to show
> >>> to
> >>> others -- this is all part of understanding and engaging in a world that
> >>> is
> >>> relentlessly visual and driven by the photographic image. However, I
> >>> stop
> >>> short when the sighted assert that a blind guy taking pictures somehow
> >>> tells
> >>> them something about being blind, apart from the fact that the blind
> >>> person
> >>> is less likely to get off a good picture.
> >>>
> >>> Brian Miller
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: "Mike Freeman" <
> >k7uij at panix.com>
> >>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >>> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 6:17 PM
> >>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> GW:
> >>>>
> >>>> As I said, I have no objection to blind persons operating cameras
> >>> though I
> >>>> cannot for the life of me fathom what they (the blind persons) would
> >>> get
> >>> out
> >>>> of the exercise other than being able to play with nifty gadgetry.
> >>> Where I
> >>>> got off the train was when the one of the persons quoted in the
> >>> article
> >>>> maintained that viewing the photos would give the sighted a glimpse of
> >>> the
> >>>> world of the blind. To engage in aliteration for a moment, that's pure
> >>>> piffle!
> >>>>
> >>>> BTW, I think it's quite important that blind persons have some grasp
> >>> of
> >>> the
> >>>> visual arts, if for no other reason that they are part of the culture
> >>> we
> >>>> inhabit. So more power to you!
> >>>>
> >>>> Mike Freeman
> >>>>
> >>>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>>> From: "George McDermith" <
> >blind_paladin at yahoo.com>
> >>>> To: <
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >>>> Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 9:26 AM
> >>>> Subject: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Greetings all!
> >>>>
> >>>> I just joined up with the list and am pleased I did so.
> >>>> Engaging dialog seems to be the name of the game on this list. I
> >>> should
> >>>> have expected it with RyanO and other delightful people I recognize
> >>>> involved. *smile*
> >>>>
> >>>> Regarding the blind photographer I think the issue can
> >>> be
> >>>> taken many different ways. On the one hand of course passing is silly
> >>> and
> >>>> not useful. On the other hand I find nothing harmful from my
> >>> viewpoint of
> >>>> doing something one enjoys, regardless of what it is. If I enjoy
> >>> having
> >>>> pictures described to me at an art museum, an activity most view as a
> >>>> sighted one, am I attempting to be sighted? Would individuals mistake
> >>> me
> >>>> for such, or would they view my different enjoyment of a common
> >>> activity
> >>> as
> >>>> an alternative technique. Some of course will be ignorant, but they
> >>> will
> >>> be
> >>>> so regardless of whether I am doing something I enjoy or not.
> >>> Additionally
> >>>> I can take the opportunity to educate them on what blindness is and
> >>> isn't.
> >>>>
> >>>> I believe this photo story falls into this category of
> >>> blind
> >>>> people doing something they enjoy. My thoughts anyway, I am looking
> >>> forward
> >>>> to a great discussion on it.
> >>>>
> >>>> Many thanks for having me on this list, it will be
> >>> superb.
> >>>>
> >>>> Sincerely,
> >>>>
> >>>> G.W. (George McDermith, Colorado Springs)
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> "I can do all things through him who strengthens me." -Philippians
> >>> 4:13
> >>>> (ESV)
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >www.christian-gamers-guild.org/sof.html
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ---------------------------------
> >>>> Now that's room service! Choose from over 150,000 hotels in 45,000
> >>>> destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> --
> >>> ------
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> nfb-talk mailing list
> >>>>
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >>>>
> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> nfb-talk mailing list
> >>>>
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >>>>
> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >>>
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> >>> nfb-talk mailing list
> >>>
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> >>
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> >> nfb-talk mailing list
> >>
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> >>
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> >>
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>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2007 22:50:44 -0600
>From: David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com>
>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Blind Photographer
>To: NFB Talk Mailing List <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070216225029.0447d168 at visi.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>I have also used one from the back seat of a taxi or other car.
>
>Dave
>
>At 09:00 AM 2/13/2007, you wrote:
> >And don't forget--sometimes we *do* have to walk up to drive-through
> >ATM's. Certainly not often, and certainly not the best (or safest)
> >option, but sometimes a necessary one anyhow. People seem to forget
> >that there are some of us who don't drive...not just blind guys,
> >either.
> >--
> >Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV
> >Independent Watkins Manager #361534
> >Email: buddy at brannan.name or phone 888-75-BUDDY
> >Shop our catalog of over 350 products for your home and health:
> >http://www.tastyshop.net
> >...And see how a Watkins business can improve your life. Read our
> >free Ebook: http://www.tastybiz.com
> >_______________________________________________
> >nfb-talk mailing list
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >
> >__________ NOD32 2057 (20070213) Information __________
> >
> >This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> >http://www.eset.com
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 08:34:27 -0600
>From: "RyanO" <rosentowski at neb.rr.com>
>Subject: [nfb-talk] Bionic Eye
>To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>Message-ID: <008701c752a0$ba589140$6701a8c0 at osentows7ff6f7>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> >From the U.K. Science-Times:
>
>February 17, 2007
>
>Bionic eye restores sight to the blind
>
>Mark Henderson, Science Editor, in San Francisco
>
>A bionic eye that can restore sight to the blind should be available
>commercially within two years, scientists behind the revolutionary
>technology announced
>yesterday.
>
>The artificial retina has been cleared by US regulators to begin trials on
>between 50 and 75 people suffering from two of the most common causes of
>blindness,
>opening the way for millions more to benefit from similar implants in the
>future.
>
>If the research progresses well, a device could be on the market early in
>2009 at a likely cost of about ?15,000, said Mark Humayun, Professor of
>Ophthalmology
>at the Doheny Eye Institute, part of the University of Southern California.
>
>An early version of the prosthetic retina has already been fitted to six
>patients with retinitis pigmentosa, a degenerative and incurable eye
>condition
>that affects 1 in 3,500 people. All have recovered the ability to detect
>light and motion, and even to make out large letters and to distinguish
>between
>objects such as a cup, a knife and a plate.
>
>The second-generation device that is now starting trials should provide even
>better vision, as it contains 60 light-sensitive electrodes, compared with
>16 in the previous model.
>
>More improvements are expected within five to seven years with a
>1000-electrode implant that will enable previously blind people to recognise
>faces, Professor
>Humayun said.
>
>"The ultimate aim is to allow people recognise faces, and to allow the
>completely blind to get around on their own," he told the American
>Association for
>the Advancement of Science conference in San Francisco. "The first phase
>began in 2002, and the results were not what we expected: we thought they
>would
>only see light and dark, but they have done far better than that.
>
>"They can differentiate between a cup, a plate and a knife. They can see
>motion. They can avoid stumbling around into large objects. That is just
>with 16
>electrodes, and we're now going up to 60. The models suggest 1,000 will be
>enough for face recognition, and we hope to get there in five to seven
>years."
>
>
>The bionic eye consists of three elements. First, a miniature camera worn in
>a pair of dark glasses, which transmits images to a radio receiver implanted
>near the patient's eye.
>
>This then sends a signal on to a tiny silicon and platinum chip, about 4mm
>square, that sits on the retina. The chip's electrodes stimulate the
>ganglion
>cells that transmit visual information to the optic nerve and onwards to the
>brain, which can then construct a visual image.
>
>"A plate is seen as a saucer of light, and a knife as a runway of light,"
>Professor Humayun said. "It works by building up images like a dot-matrix
>printer,
>or pixels on a computer screen." The implant is suitable for people who are
>blind because they have lost the photoreceptor cells known as rods and cones
>that respond to light - the electrodes effectively provide artificial
>replacements. This includes those with macular degeneration - the most
>common cause
>of blindness, which affects up to 15 per cent of over-75s.
>
>The technology cannot restore sight to patients who are blind because of
>severe optic nerve damage, such as that caused by glaucoma, or because of a
>stroke.
>
>
>Professor Humayun said that it would also work better for people who have
>been able to see as older children or adults, than for those who have been
>blind
>since birth.
>
>It generally takes patients a month or two to get used to the Argus device,
>before their brains learn to interpret the images. While the operation to
>install
>it took seven hours originally, it now takes 90 minutes.
>
>In the first phase of the trials, patients were able to use the implant in
>the laboratory only. For the past year they have also been allowed to try it
>at home. "Perhaps what we're most excited about in this next study is we
>will be able to test the new device with patients at their homes, churches,
>schools
>and similar locations," Professor Humayun said.
>
>The trials will be conducted at five centres in the US, on patients over 50.
>The US Food and Drug Administration has insisted on older subjects as they
>have less to lose if the experiments go wrong.
>
>Thousands of people have already volunteered.
>
>
>
>RyanO
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 09:49:08 -0600
>From: "Aaron Cannon" <cannona at fireantproductions.com>
>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Bionic Eye
>To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>Message-ID: <011c01c752ac$58996950$0300a8c0 at blackbox>
>Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>"The ultimate aim is to allow people recognize faces, and to allow the
>completely blind to get around on their own,"
>
>That will be incredible! I can't wait to be able to get around on my own,
>because I sure can't do that now.
>
>Seriously though, the technology is interesting. I just wish they didn't
>hold them selves out as the last hope of the hopeless blind.
>
>Aaron
>
>
>- --
>Skype: cannona
>MSN/Windows Messenger: cannona at hotmail.com (don't send email to the hotmail
>address.)
>- ----- Original Message -----
>From: "RyanO" <rosentowski at neb.rr.com>
>To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2007 8:34 AM
>Subject: [nfb-talk] Bionic Eye
>
>
> >From the U.K. Science-Times:
>
>February 17, 2007
>
>Bionic eye restores sight to the blind
>
>Mark Henderson, Science Editor, in San Francisco
>
>A bionic eye that can restore sight to the blind should be available
>commercially within two years, scientists behind the revolutionary
>technology announced
>yesterday.
>
>The artificial retina has been cleared by US regulators to begin trials on
>between 50 and 75 people suffering from two of the most common causes of
>blindness,
>opening the way for millions more to benefit from similar implants in the
>future.
>
>If the research progresses well, a device could be on the market early in
>2009 at a likely cost of about ?15,000, said Mark Humayun, Professor of
>Ophthalmology
>at the Doheny Eye Institute, part of the University of Southern California.
>
>An early version of the prosthetic retina has already been fitted to six
>patients with retinitis pigmentosa, a degenerative and incurable eye
>condition
>that affects 1 in 3,500 people. All have recovered the ability to detect
>light and motion, and even to make out large letters and to distinguish
>between
>objects such as a cup, a knife and a plate.
>
>The second-generation device that is now starting trials should provide even
>better vision, as it contains 60 light-sensitive electrodes, compared with
>16 in the previous model.
>
>More improvements are expected within five to seven years with a
>1000-electrode implant that will enable previously blind people to recognise
>faces, Professor
>Humayun said.
>
>"The ultimate aim is to allow people recognise faces, and to allow the
>completely blind to get around on their own," he told the American
>Association for
>the Advancement of Science conference in San Francisco. "The first phase
>began in 2002, and the results were not what we expected: we thought they
>would
>only see light and dark, but they have done far better than that.
>
>"They can differentiate between a cup, a plate and a knife. They can see
>motion. They can avoid stumbling around into large objects. That is just
>with 16
>electrodes, and we're now going up to 60. The models suggest 1,000 will be
>enough for face recognition, and we hope to get there in five to seven
>years."
>
>
>The bionic eye consists of three elements. First, a miniature camera worn in
>a pair of dark glasses, which transmits images to a radio receiver implanted
>near the patient's eye.
>
>This then sends a signal on to a tiny silicon and platinum chip, about 4mm
>square, that sits on the retina. The chip's electrodes stimulate the
>ganglion
>cells that transmit visual information to the optic nerve and onwards to the
>brain, which can then construct a visual image.
>
>"A plate is seen as a saucer of light, and a knife as a runway of light,"
>Professor Humayun said. "It works by building up images like a dot-matrix
>printer,
>or pixels on a computer screen." The implant is suitable for people who are
>blind because they have lost the photoreceptor cells known as rods and cones
>that respond to light - the electrodes effectively provide artificial
>replacements. This includes those with macular degeneration - the most
>common cause
>of blindness, which affects up to 15 per cent of over-75s.
>
>The technology cannot restore sight to patients who are blind because of
>severe optic nerve damage, such as that caused by glaucoma, or because of a
>stroke.
>
>
>Professor Humayun said that it would also work better for people who have
>been able to see as older children or adults, than for those who have been
>blind
>since birth.
>
>It generally takes patients a month or two to get used to the Argus device,
>before their brains learn to interpret the images. While the operation to
>install
>it took seven hours originally, it now takes 90 minutes.
>
>In the first phase of the trials, patients were able to use the implant in
>the laboratory only. For the past year they have also been allowed to try it
>at home. "Perhaps what we're most excited about in this next study is we
>will be able to test the new device with patients at their homes, churches,
>schools
>and similar locations," Professor Humayun said.
>
>The trials will be conducted at five centres in the US, on patients over 50.
>The US Food and Drug Administration has insisted on older subjects as they
>have less to lose if the experiments go wrong.
>
>Thousands of people have already volunteered.
>
>
>
>RyanO
>
>_______________________________________________
>nfb-talk mailing list
>nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
>
>
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>DmSx1DEDnz4knXiFA00zhiE=
>=azjb
>-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2007 11:04:11 -0500
>From: "Wm. Ritchhart" <william.ritchhart at sbcglobal.net>
>Subject: [nfb-talk] READING JAWS/WITH EYES
>To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>Message-ID: <008601c752ad$43eaa720$4001a8c0 at RITCHHART>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>The big disadvantage to using JAWS or talking books for reading is that
>you miss the seeing or touching of the letters. It is more difficult to
>learn spelling and phonics when you are read to, rather than reading for
>yourself.
>
>Sure, many blind people listen to books at high rates of speed. Many
>people, both sighted and blind read at high rates of speed. Like with
>most things, I prefer to evaluate the task and choose the method that I
>believe fits the need best.
>William
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>On Behalf Of Buddy Brannan
>Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2007 1:22 PM
>To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Utah Woman is 'Blind No More'
>
>On Thu, Feb 15, 2007 at 01:09:59PM -0500, Josh wrote:
> > And even if I could see I would still use jaws. The speech is faster
>than
> > you can read using your eyes probably.
>
>Well...umm, probably not. Some people can read pretty fast!
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>
>
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>End of nfb-talk Digest, Vol 9, Issue 38
>***************************************