[nfb-talk] ACB members in NFB

Mon Aug 7 06:28:30 CDT 2006

Samira,

Voting rights come with a paid membership.  It is quite possible to be a
member of both organizations in terms of membership dues paid.  It's just
hard to be a full and active member of both, given how often it seems that
the ACB viewpoint is that the NFB is wrong, regardless of what the NFB
says or does as an organization.

Of course, it may not actually be true that it is the official position
that the NFB is always wrong, it just seems like it from here.  I would
personally love to see someone from the ACB and someone from the NFB sit
down and hammer out a strategy to improve legislation such as IDEA.

I bet we've got common ground there.  I think, if two such people were
willing, that you'd find a whole bunch of Federationists who were
skeptical that such a thing would ever bear fruit.  In my own skepticism,
I expect you'd find most of the ACB refusing to support any fruit of the
effort, good or bad.  Still, if it were the right two people and they
really did sit down and hammer out improvements to IDEA while dodging the
slings and arrows, the result would be amazing.

(That's a challenge, by the way, to anyone in the NFB or ACB who has the
skill and connections through lobbying efforts of our respective
organizations, to decide that our future is more important than some silly
feud that was started before us young'uns were born, and to step up and
prove it can be done...  I can already read the headline on the press
releases:  DEVIL WEARS ICE SKATES TO WORK TODAY...)

On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 12:08:38AM -0700, S Farwaneh wrote:
> OK; we should be able to  discuss ACB and NFB in a civil manner without
> allowing the discussion to disintegrate into inflammatory statements.
> 
> The issue with dual membership has nothing to do with federal laws or
> democracy; political parties impose similar restrictions; if you are a
> registered democrat, you are not allowed to vote in a republican primary or
> vice versa, but you are welcome to attend and read the literature if you
> wish. Let us not confuse civil rights with ideologies.  Because our
> ideology is drastically different from that of ACB, we have stood on
> opposite sides vis-à-vis several issues making it difficult if not
> impossible for a member to be loyal to both organizations and benefit both
> simultaneously. I would definitely welcome an ACB member, or anyone else
> for that matter, to attend NFB meetings and conventions; but it would be
> difficult to appoint them as board members, give them voting rights or
> assign them responsibilities that put them in a position to represent NFB
> in a public setting.
> 
> I hope we can limit our messages to constructive feedback; otherwise, I
> suggest closing this thread. Anyone is welcome to email me privately if
> s/he has input and wishes to avert overreacting responses on the list.
> 
> Thank you,
> Samira
> 
> 
> At 12:32 AM 8/7/06 -0400, joe harcz wrote:
> >If you aren't too dumb to research it then research it.
> >
> >That is Section 504 of the Rehabilitation Act of 1973.
> >
> >I'd cite the exact USC but would't wish to offend you.
> >
> >Joe
> >----- Original Message ----- 
> >From: "Hope Hein" <hmhein at verizon.net>
> >To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 11:54 PM
> >Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] ACB members in NFB
> >
> >
> >> There was no reason to respond in this way! There was no need to respond
> >> with that kind of message! How do YOU know if blind know all about Section
> >> 504 or the Civil Rights Act? If you are visually impaired, and demeaning
> >> other blind, SHAME ON YOU! You accuse us of being TOO DUMB to research
> >> Section 504 or the Civil Rights Act. Again, SHAME ON YOU!
> >>
> >> (signed) Annoyed!! Hope and Karl Hein
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> >> Behalf Of joe harcz
> >> Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 11:38 PM
> >> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
> >> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] ACB members in NFB
> >>
> >> what A LOVELY AND MOST GOOFY RESPONSE.
> >>
> >> thanks I'm SURE IT IS REPRESENTATIVE OF THE MINDSET OF  BOTH ORGANIZATIONS
> >> OF THE BLIND. I'm MORE CERTAIN THAT nfb IN PARTICULAR PLACES ITS 
> >> PHILOSOPHY
> >> OVER ESTABLISHED FEDERAL AND STATE LAWS INCLUDING section 504 OF THE
> >> rehabilitation act OF 1973. iT IS APPLICABLE IF YOU ALL RECEIVE FEDERAL
> >> FUNDS AND YOU ALL DO VIS A VIS nEWSLINE, kfb rEADER AND SO ON AND SO 
> >> FORTH.
> >>
> >> in OTHER WORDS ALL IF YOU ACCEPT FEDERAL FUNDS YOU ALL MUST A BIDE BY
> >> FEDERAL CIVIL RIGHTS RULES OR FOREGOES THOSE FUNDS AND YOU IN nfb HAVE NOT
> >> DONE SO.
> >>
> >> but I'm WASTING MY WORDS UPON THOSE WHO JUST DON'T FOLLOW THOSE RULES AND
> >> THOSE WHO THINK ONLY IN PLATITUDES.
> >>
> >> mind YOU TO BE FAIR THE BULK OF acb ARE ALSO BRAINWASHED FOLKS WHO 
> >> WOULDN'T
> >> KNOW CIVIL RIGHTS IF THEY BIT THEM ON THEIR SORRY BEHINDS!
> >>
> >> aND NO, THE TERM "BEHIND" IS NOT PORNOGRAPHIC. iT MEANS THAT YOU AND 
> >> OTHERS
> >> ARE BEHIND THE TIMES.
> >>
> >> bUT i PRE-EMPT...
> >>
> >> sIGH...
> >>
> >> jOE
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: "Alan Wheeler" <awheeler at neb.rr.com>
> >> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >> Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 11:14 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] ACB members in NFB
> >>
> >>
> >>> They can if you become a nuisance, or spew obscenities and hate speech.
> >>> Now, mind you, I didn't say you *HAVE* done that, but if you ever did,
> >>> then
> >>> they would have every right to keep you off the list serve at their
> >>> discretion.
> >>>
> >>> Why I say this, so I am clear that I am not singling you out is, for
> >>> example, if a person got on here and wrote sexually explicit messages, or
> >>> talked about killing federationists in gas chambers, or some such thing,
> >>> the
> >>> list owners would have every right to block that person from the list
> >>> serve.
> >>> That said, however, who they block is at their discretion, so if you're
> >>> not
> >>> as bad as the examples I cited above, and yet, disrupt the function of 
> >>> the
> >>> list, then they *STILL* have the right.
> >>>
> >>> It isn't all about legalities.  To me it's about keeping an even keel...a
> >>> smoothly flowing community and not a divisive one going on the list.
> >>>
> >>> Granted, I've seen divisiveness get cut a bit too much slack on this list
> >>> (and I'm not aiming at specific targets here, either), but again, list
> >>> owner
> >>> discretion. *SMILE*
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message ----- 
> >>> From: "joe harcz" <michiganadapt at peoplepc.com>
> >>> To: <lras at sprynet.com>; "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >>> Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 10:07 PM
> >>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] ACB members in NFB
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> iS nfb WILLING TO FOREGOE FEDERAL FUNDING? hARDLY, AND THUS THEY MUST
> >>>> COMPLY
> >>>> WITH DUEL MEMBERSHIP.
> >>>>
> >>>> aND THEY CANNOT BUMP ME FROM THESE LIST SERVES EITHER LEGALLY!
> >>>>
> >>>> jOE
> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
> >>>> From: "Lloyd Rasmussen" <lras at sprynet.com>
> >>>> To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> >>>> Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 11:02 PM
> >>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] ACB members in NFB
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>I would take this question up with your state president in Arizona.  It
> >>>>> would depend on what this person did or continues to do in support of
> >>>>> the
> >>>>> ACB, particularly regarding areas where the NFB and ACB don't agree on
> >>>>> the
> >>>>> national or local level.  We have our policy against dual memberships,
> >>>>> and
> >>>>> I
> >>>>> believe it is a sound policy.  On the other hand, we need to be a
> >>>>> welcoming
> >>>>> organization, not treating everybody with suspicion.  The important
> >>>>> thing
> >>>>> is
> >>>>> that we have a huge amount of work in front of us to change what it
> >>>>> means
> >>>>> to
> >>>>> be blind.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Lloyd Rasmussen, Kensington, Maryland
> >>>>> Home:  http://lras.home.sprynet.com
> >>>>> Work:  http://www.loc.gov/nls
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
> >>>>>> On
> >>>>>> Behalf Of S Farwaneh
> >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, August 06, 2006 9:51 PM
> >>>>>> To: nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>> Subject: [nfb-talk] ACB members in NFB
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Hello Everyone,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I have a question about how to best accommodate active ACB members who
> >>>>>> try
> >>>>>> to join the NFB. My understanding is that NFB policies prohibit 
> >>>>>> ACB/NFB
> >>>>>> dual membership. We have an ACB member in our midst who was informed
> >>>>>> about
> >>>>>> the policy, whereupon she denied her affiliation with ACB. We have
> >>>>>> philosophical differences concerning this issue: Some members believe
> >>>>>> that
> >>>>>> we should take her word for it and allow her to participate fully in
> >>>>>> NFB
> >>>>>> activities in the hopes that she will ultimately become a functional
> >>>>>> member; others request that her terminated affiliation with ACB be
> >>>>>> verified
> >>>>>> to  ensure that our chapters are not infiltrated by ACB members who
> >>>>>> believe
> >>>>>> that their mission is to 'reform' the NFB.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I wonder if you have a similar experience to report, and what the best
> >>>>>> strategy is to expand our membership without jeopardizing our
> >>>>>> philosophy
> >>>>>> and policies.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks,
> >>>>>> Samira Farwaneh
> >>>>>> Tucson Chapter, NFBA
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Samira Farwaneh
> >>>>>> Assistant Professor, Arabic Language and Linguistics
> >>>>>> Department of Near Eastern Studies
> >>>>>> Department of Linguistics
> >>>>>> Second Language Acquisition and Teaching Program
> >>>>>> Louise Foucar Marshall Building
> >>>>>> 845 N Park Avenue, Room 440
> >>>>>> PO BOX 210158B
> >>>>>> University of Arizona
> >>>>>> Tucson, Arizona  85721-0158B
> >>>>>> Phone: (520) 621-8629 Or 621-8012
> >>>>>> Fax: (520) 621-2333
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
> >>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> -- 
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> >>>>> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/409 - Release Date: 
> >>>>> 8/4/2006
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
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> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> nfb-talk mailing list
> >>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >>>>
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> >>>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> nfb-talk mailing list
> >>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >>>
> >>>
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> >>> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> >>> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/409 - Release Date: 8/4/2006
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -- 
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> >> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> >> Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/409 - Release Date: 8/4/2006
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nfb-talk mailing list
> >> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nfb-talk mailing list
> >> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >>
> >>
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> >> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
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> >>
> >> 
> >
> >
> >
> >-- 
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> >Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> >Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.7/409 - Release Date: 8/4/2006
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >nfb-talk mailing list
> >nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> >http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk
> >
> 
> Samira Farwaneh
> Assistant Professor, Arabic Language and Linguistics
> Department of Near Eastern Studies
> Department of Linguistics
> Second Language Acquisition and Teaching Program
> Louise Foucar Marshall Building
> 845 N Park Avenue, Room 440
> PO BOX 210158B
> University of Arizona
> Tucson, Arizona  85721-0158B
> Phone: (520) 621-8629 Or 621-8012
> Fax: (520) 621-2333
> _______________________________________________
> nfb-talk mailing list
> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk