[nagdu] Ivy Creek info

Mon Feb 21 13:45:44 CST 2005

Okay, here's what I found out.  I sent a list of questions I thought would give a good overall picture of what the program is about.  I would like to point out that my list of questions is very long, but I felt it important for me to know the answers to  each one so that I would have enough information to make a good decision.  Most of the answers to my questions could be found in publicly obtainable information from other programs.  Since the Ivy Creek web site offers very little information I felt it reasonable to ask.  Pasted below are my questions and the answers given, if any.  After my questions are a couple of paragraphs about the program also obtained through email correspondence.  

How long has your program been in existence? ( 5 years)
What is the address and telephone number for your program? (409 Paradise Point, Abbeville, SC 29620) (864 446 8129)
How many instructors/trainers  do you have? (1)
What are the qualifications of each instructor? (I was trained at Southeastern where Mike Sargent oversaw my training)
What experience does each instructor have with training guide dogs? (Trained at Southeastern and 5 years at Ivy Creek)
What experience does each instructor have with working with blind people? (see above)

How do you ensure the quality of the training? ( From time to time, I will go blindfolded with the dogs and have an assistant follow behind as we test the
skills of the dog. But, every day as I train each dog, I  evaluate the skills of each dog and make sure it is progressing as it should for that point in
time in it's training.)

Is there a standardized test or set of requirements that each dog/team must meet in order to complete the training? (yes)
How long is each dog trained? ( 4 to 6 months, depending on the individual dog)
What commands are the dogs taught? (Each dog is taught approximately 40 commands, including obedience, locating objects, and the guide dog skills.)
What are the ages and breeds of dogs used? (We use English Labs that come to Ivy Creek at 8 weeks of age, they then spend 14 months with a puppy raiser,
and are about 18 to 20 months when they leave Ivy Creek with their new partner.)
What health screening is done? (such as hip and elbow X-rays, hearing, vision, etc.) (Before breeding, the parents are checked for hip or elbow dysplasia, Pregressive
Retenal Atrophy, and sound hearts. Before the dogs come back from the puppy raisers, they are all x-rayed for hip or elbow problems.)
What are the dogs fed? (Eukanuba)
What is the average age of retirement of your dogs? (We are a new school and have no retirees yet)
What is the percentage of dogs returned before retirement? (due to health issues, training problems or a change in lifestyle of the handler etc) ( We have
had two dogs come back to us. One was because of a change of lifestyle and the other was because the handler had some emotional problems that she could
not overcome. Both dogs were successfully placed with new handlers.)
What is your application process for a blind person considering your program? ( Telephone interview, Paper application, and an in home interview.)
How long does this process take? ( The thing that takes the longest is getting the paper application back, so it is up to the individual. We have had people
go from their first phone call to going home with a dog in two months.) To be continued!!!!
What are the requirements of the blind person? (such as physical health, age, degree of vision loss, employment etc)
How long would a prospective candidate expect to wait for a dog?
How long would a person expect to wait for a successor dog?
Is the application process the same for successor dogs?
What follow up services do you provide?
What expenses are involved on the part of the blind handler in participating in your program? (such as transportation, food, dog equipment, room and board, etc)
What expenses are assumed by the handler after completion of your program? (such as food, vet care, replacement equipment, etc)
Does the blind handler assume legal ownership of the dog upon completion of the program?
Do you utilize puppy raisers?
If so, what training/requirements must the puppy raiser have?
I noticed on your web site that you are asking for a sighted attendant to accompany the blind person.  Please explain the reason for this.
Are all the expenses of the sighted person paid for by your program?
What situations are the dogs trained to handle? (such as subways, airplanes, escalators, elevators, trains, rural roads etc)
What would a typical day of training with dog and handler include?
What is the role of the instructor in working with the dog and handler team?
Is there opportunity for independent work in the last stages of training?
What opportunities are available during the training? (such as shopping, dining out, movies, theater, museums etc.)
What opportunities are available on campus?  (such as exercise room, computers, internet, telephones, walking paths, swimming pool, cassette or Braille books, vending
machines, etc.)
What items do you suggest that students bring with them for the training?
Do you employ blind persons in any capacity in your program?
What types of jobs do these persons hold?
If a qualified blind person applied for a position in your company would you consider hiring them?
Why or why not?
I noticed that you offer home training.  Under what circumstances is home training an option?
Do you train dogs for any other work?  (service, therapy, hearing, police, search and rescue etc)

Hi Julie,
I don't mind your questions if you don't mind me answering them this way.
My experience prior to training guide dogs is similar to yours. I have been training and competing with dogs in obedience for over 20 years. I had an obedience
school for 12 years just prior to working with guide dogs. I have trained dogs for obedience, trick competition, the breed ring, and drafting.
I am a draft judge for the BMDCA and besides judging Berners, I have judge the Rotty Speciality as well. I get more satisfaction (and less money) training
guidedogs than anything else I have ever done with dogs
Now back to your questions.
Requirements for a guide dog:
Legally blind, mature enough and healthy enough to work a dog and properly take care of it, enough of an income to properly take care of theirs and their
dog's needs.
The wait for a dog: Because we are a small school, we do not have a big pool of trained dogs to be matched up with individuals. At best, we have 2 to 4
dogs ready at any one time. As long as we have a good match, 2 to 3 months is all that most have to wait.
Graduates wanting a successor dog should not have to wait as long. Since they are thoroughly checked out the first time and since we try to keep in touch
with our graduates, the re-application process should move right along.
Follow up services: After people spend 4 weeks at Ivy Creek, I will go to where they live for two days to work with them on the routes they will be traveling
with their dog. If they need my help anytime after that, they have my work, cell, and home phone numbers with instructions to call me anytime. If necessary,
I will make arrangements to go work with them again.
Expenses: Transportation to and from Ivy Creek. We have a fully furnished guest house and have enough food for two days. So, the student has to supply their
own food. We take them to the store as many times as they want. We do supply all the dog food and give them some to take with them.
After training expenses: The graduate assumes all expenses.
We have a contract that is signed after training that says " for the price of one dollar" all of our rights in the dog are turned over to the graduate and
if for any reason, during the life of the dog, the graduate can not keep the dog, we have the right to buy it back for one dollar.
Yes, we have some wonderful puppy raisers. Our application process is similar to the application for a guide dog. There is a telephone interview, an application
to be filled out and sent in, and an in home interview. There is a manual to guide them but we have regular training sessions as well. AND each puppy raiser
also has my work, cell, and home numbers, if they need me.
There are several reasons why we ask that a sighted person stay with the student during training.
First: We are a small school and do not have a staft that is here 24 hours a day to assist the student with any needs. Sometimes at night and on weekends
there is no one around for miles.
Second: We are located almost 20 miles from the nearest town. I live 20 miles away from Ivy Creek myself. If a person needed emergency help, It might not
be timely.
Third: There is a liability issue. If someone got hurt seriously under these conditions, I am sure that could be the end of Ivy Creek.
Every student and sighted person that stayed at the guest house enjoyed their time there. A few asked if they could stay longer after training was completed.
The only expenses the sighted person has are travel and food. We do not pay for these.
Keep in mind that we are a small school. We are currently only servicing North and South Carolina and Georgia. So, subways are not an issue. Many of our
dogs have flown with our puppy raisers, but it is not part of our regular training. I advise our graduates to stay away from escalators. I saw a dog's
paw get caught in an escalator down in Florida and was told by one trainer that she knew of at least six others that this happened to. There are always
stairs and elevators as an alternative. However, I have trained dogs and handlers and dogs on escalators and will again if it is insisted upon. We do revolving
doors, elevators, rural roads, etc. Since it is one on one training, I try to custimize it for the individual.
-------------- next part --------------
Okay, here's what I found out.  I sent a list of questions I thought would give a good overall picture of what the program is about.  I would like to point out that my list of questions is very long, but I felt it important for me to know the answers to  each one so that I would have enough information to make a good decision.  Most of the answers to my questions could be found in publicly obtainable information from other programs.  Since the Ivy Creek web site offers very little information I felt it reasonable to ask.  Pasted below are my questions and the answers given, if any.  After my questions are a couple of paragraphs about the program also obtained through email correspondence. 

How long has your program been in existence? ( 5 years)
What is the address and telephone number for your program? (409 Paradise Point, Abbeville, SC 29620) (864 446 8129)
How many instructors/trainers  do you have? (1)
What are the qualifications of each instructor? (I was trained at Southeastern where Mike Sargent oversaw my training)
What experience does each instructor have with training guide dogs? (Trained at Southeastern and 5 years at Ivy Creek)
What experience does each instructor have with working with blind people? (see above)

How do you ensure the quality of the training? ( From time to time, I will go blindfolded with the dogs and have an assistant follow behind as we test the
skills of the dog. But, every day as I train each dog, I  evaluate the skills of each dog and make sure it is progressing as it should for that point in
time in it's training.)

Is there a standardized test or set of requirements that each dog/team must meet in order to complete the training? (yes)
How long is each dog trained? ( 4 to 6 months, depending on the individual dog)
What commands are the dogs taught? (Each dog is taught approximately 40 commands, including obedience, locating objects, and the guide dog skills.)
What are the ages and breeds of dogs used? (We use English Labs that come to Ivy Creek at 8 weeks of age, they then spend 14 months with a puppy raiser,
and are about 18 to 20 months when they leave Ivy Creek with their new partner.)
What health screening is done? (such as hip and elbow X-rays, hearing, vision, etc.) (Before breeding, the parents are checked for hip or elbow dysplasia, Pregressive
Retenal Atrophy, and sound hearts. Before the dogs come back from the puppy raisers, they are all x-rayed for hip or elbow problems.)
What are the dogs fed? (Eukanuba)
What is the average age of retirement of your dogs? (We are a new school and have no retirees yet)
What is the percentage of dogs returned before retirement? (due to health issues, training problems or a change in lifestyle of the handler etc) ( We have
had two dogs come back to us. One was because of a change of lifestyle and the other was because the handler had some emotional problems that she could
not overcome. Both dogs were successfully placed with new handlers.)
What is your application process for a blind person considering your program? ( Telephone interview, Paper application, and an in home interview.)
How long does this process take? ( The thing that takes the longest is getting the paper application back, so it is up to the individual. We have had people
go from their first phone call to going home with a dog in two months.) To be continued!!!!
What are the requirements of the blind person? (such as physical health, age, degree of vision loss, employment etc)
How long would a prospective candidate expect to wait for a dog?
How long would a person expect to wait for a successor dog?
Is the application process the same for successor dogs?
What follow up services do you provide?
What expenses are involved on the part of the blind handler in participating in your program? (such as transportation, food, dog equipment, room and board, etc)
What expenses are assumed by the handler after completion of your program? (such as food, vet care, replacement equipment, etc)
Does the blind handler assume legal ownership of the dog upon completion of the program?
Do you utilize puppy raisers?
If so, what training/requirements must the puppy raiser have?
I noticed on your web site that you are asking for a sighted attendant to accompany the blind person.  Please explain the reason for this.
Are all the expenses of the sighted person paid for by your program?
What situations are the dogs trained to handle? (such as subways, airplanes, escalators, elevators, trains, rural roads etc)
What would a typical day of training with dog and handler include?
What is the role of the instructor in working with the dog and handler team?
Is there opportunity for independent work in the last stages of training?
What opportunities are available during the training? (such as shopping, dining out, movies, theater, museums etc.)
What opportunities are available on campus?  (such as exercise room, computers, internet, telephones, walking paths, swimming pool, cassette or Braille books, vending
machines, etc.)
What items do you suggest that students bring with them for the training?
Do you employ blind persons in any capacity in your program?
What types of jobs do these persons hold?
If a qualified blind person applied for a position in your company would you consider hiring them?
Why or why not?
I noticed that you offer home training.  Under what circumstances is home training an option?
Do you train dogs for any other work?  (service, therapy, hearing, police, search and rescue etc)

Hi Julie,
I don't mind your questions if you don't mind me answering them this way.
My experience prior to training guide dogs is similar to yours. I have been training and competing with dogs in obedience for over 20 years. I had an obedience
school for 12 years just prior to working with guide dogs. I have trained dogs for obedience, trick competition, the breed ring, and drafting.
I am a draft judge for the BMDCA and besides judging Berners, I have judge the Rotty Speciality as well. I get more satisfaction (and less money) training
guidedogs than anything else I have ever done with dogs
Now back to your questions.
Requirements for a guide dog:
Legally blind, mature enough and healthy enough to work a dog and properly take care of it, enough of an income to properly take care of theirs and their
dog's needs.
The wait for a dog: Because we are a small school, we do not have a big pool of trained dogs to be matched up with individuals. At best, we have 2 to 4
dogs ready at any one time. As long as we have a good match, 2 to 3 months is all that most have to wait.
Graduates wanting a successor dog should not have to wait as long. Since they are thoroughly checked out the first time and since we try to keep in touch
with our graduates, the re-application process should move right along.
Follow up services: After people spend 4 weeks at Ivy Creek, I will go to where they live for two days to work with them on the routes they will be traveling
with their dog. If they need my help anytime after that, they have my work, cell, and home phone numbers with instructions to call me anytime. If necessary,
I will make arrangements to go work with them again.
Expenses: Transportation to and from Ivy Creek. We have a fully furnished guest house and have enough food for two days. So, the student has to supply their
own food. We take them to the store as many times as they want. We do supply all the dog food and give them some to take with them.
After training expenses: The graduate assumes all expenses.
We have a contract that is signed after training that says " for the price of one dollar" all of our rights in the dog are turned over to the graduate and
if for any reason, during the life of the dog, the graduate can not keep the dog, we have the right to buy it back for one dollar.
Yes, we have some wonderful puppy raisers. Our application process is similar to the application for a guide dog. There is a telephone interview, an application
to be filled out and sent in, and an in home interview. There is a manual to guide them but we have regular training sessions as well. AND each puppy raiser
also has my work, cell, and home numbers, if they need me.
There are several reasons why we ask that a sighted person stay with the student during training.
First: We are a small school and do not have a staft that is here 24 hours a day to assist the student with any needs. Sometimes at night and on weekends
there is no one around for miles.
Second: We are located almost 20 miles from the nearest town. I live 20 miles away from Ivy Creek myself. If a person needed emergency help, It might not
be timely.
Third: There is a liability issue. If someone got hurt seriously under these conditions, I am sure that could be the end of Ivy Creek.
Every student and sighted person that stayed at the guest house enjoyed their time there. A few asked if they could stay longer after training was completed.
The only expenses the sighted person has are travel and food. We do not pay for these.
Keep in mind that we are a small school. We are currently only servicing North and South Carolina and Georgia. So, subways are not an issue. Many of our
dogs have flown with our puppy raisers, but it is not part of our regular training. I advise our graduates to stay away from escalators. I saw a dog's
paw get caught in an escalator down in Florida and was told by one trainer that she knew of at least six others that this happened to. There are always
stairs and elevators as an alternative. However, I have trained dogs and handlers and dogs on escalators and will again if it is insisted upon. We do revolving
doors, elevators, rural roads, etc. Since it is one on one training, I try to custimize it for the individual.