[gui-talk] an I.e8 inquiry

Fri May 8 21:40:14 UTC 2009

After installing IE 8 I was having some trouble with my banking site.  They 
put up a notice that to fix the problems with IE 8 and their site you should 
uninstall the flash player and reinstall it.  At least on this banking site 
it did fix the problem.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "albert griffith" <albertgriffith at sbcglobal.net>
To: "'NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List'" <gui-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 2:36 PM
Subject: Re: [gui-talk] an I.e8 inquiry


> Andy, you left out flash which is often inaccessible.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Baracco, Andrew W
> Sent: Friday, May 08, 2009 11:59 AM
> To: NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [gui-talk] an I.e8 inquiry
>
> Well!  I'm not the greatest web surfer in the world by any means, but I
> think to say that most web sites are not accessible to the blind is a
> bit over the top.  The vast majority of sites that I visit are
> accessible, not always convenient, but accessible. Many people who say
> that sites are not accessible are not using all of the capabilities of
> their screen reader.  For me, and I am just speaking for me, the only
> inaccessible thing that i run up against is the CAPTCHA, and I could
> manage most of them if I wanted to bother to install Firefox with the
> Webvism plugin.
>
> Andy
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
> On Behalf Of James Pepper
> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 5:26 PM
> To: NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [gui-talk] an I.e8 inquiry
>
> We can talk theory all we want but the reality out there is that most
> websites are not accessible.  Face it, mnost of the content in webpages
> is not accessible to the blind.  It is an intolerable situation.  There
> is no meeting of the minds between content authors and the blind and
> that standard should be the goal of all accessibility discussions.
>
> What we need is a practical standard for accessibility where the web
> designer designs for screen readers to use their pages.  This is not
> happening now and it is a disgrace.  This is not difficult to achieve,
> it is a matter of designing a webpage with accessibility in mind as you
> design the page.
>
> It is when people start creating new technologies to solve the problems
> of accessibility in the future and set lofty goals but they do not make
> things accessible in the here and now and in the case of Yahoo they just
> went ahead and updated their software without any regard to whether the
> blind could use it or not.
>
>
>
> On Thu, May 7, 2009 at 5:47 PM, albert griffith <
> albertgriffith at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>
>> Allen, also, the people who need the accessibility features need to be
>
>> in a position to take advantage of them as they're developed.  The
>> only way to do that is to stay current with upgrades and updates.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>
>> On Behalf Of Hoffman, Allen
>> Sent: Thursday, May 07, 2009 2:58 PM
>> To: gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>> Subject: [gui-talk] an I.e8 inquiry
>>
>> James Pepper wrote:
>> The big problem here is that designers cannot design webpages for
>> accessibility under the old standards, they are hardly going to be
>> able to do it for the new standards.
>>
>> First of all, developers can code to the old standards quite well, but
>
>> generally do not include such coding in their standard practices.
>> This is due to many factors, including lack of priority by those who
>> set their requirements, e.g. the guy with the money, and a general
>> lack of professional and institutional inclusion of these requirements
>
>> in education.  Blaming developers for something that is larger than
>> individual developer won't help, and places blame inaccurately, and in
>
>> the end is just too simplistic.
>>
>> The new standards, while more complex, will be more used if, developer
>
>> tools include them as part of standard operation, and not following
>> such accessibility standards becomes an intentional choice.  For
>> example, if a developer places an image on the page, a bubble should
>> pop up and note an alternate description is required to meet WCAG
> standards.
>> Additionally, if ARIA interface elements are missing appropriate
>> accessibility attributes, developers should actually have to override
>> the defaults to get them saved for publication.  Finally, most Web
>> development tools do leave traces as to their use in the background
>> commented code of a page.  once a list of tools which, if used per
>> plan, produce accessible outputs is known, one can then in theory
>> locate people who go out of their way to produce inaccessible pages.
>> Such folks should be targeted for feedback, since not only are they
>> not meeting people with disabilities needs, but they have done so
>> intentionally, not from lack of knowledge or ability, but for some
>> other reason.
>>
>> furthermore, more emphasis must be placed on getting meeting
>> accessibility requirements in to standard IT professionals minimum
>> acceptable certification processes.  It is hard to expect we'll
>> improve overall accessibility of IT products if the people who develop
>
>> and invent them don't understand the needs, nor the technical
>> solutions to meet those needs.
>>
>>
>>
>> Allen Hoffman
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> gui-talk mailing list
>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> gui-talk:
>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/albertgriffi
>> th%40s
>> bcglobal.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> gui-talk mailing list
>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> gui-talk:
>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/b75205%40gma
>> il.com
>>
> _______________________________________________
> gui-talk mailing list
> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> gui-talk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/andrew.baracco
> %40va.gov
>
> _______________________________________________
> gui-talk mailing list
> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> gui-talk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/albertgriffith%40s
> bcglobal.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> gui-talk mailing list
> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> gui-talk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/lmddh50%40comcast.net