[gui-talk] Voiceover

Mike Arrigo n0oxy at charter.net
Sun Jul 26 19:05:25 UTC 2009 

The command key is a macintosh modifier key, and it's probably the one  
that is most used. For example, you press command c for copy, command  
o for open, etc.
On Jul 26, 2009, at 1:47 PM, albert griffith wrote:

> I know this might sound real ignorant coming from a person with ten  
> years of
> computer experience but what is the command key?  I'm guessing I've  
> heard it
> by another name.  thanks
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:gui-talk- 
> bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Mike Arrigo
> Sent: Sunday, July 26, 2009 9:47 AM
> To: NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [gui-talk] Voiceover
>
> It's the f5 on the top of the keyboard, you hold the command key while
> pressing it.
> On Jul 25, 2009, at 9:44 PM, albert griffith wrote:
>
>> When you say, "command f5 is that the same as the F5 function the
>> top of the
>> keyboard?  Also is it just one keystroke or do you somehow have to
>> press a
>> command key plus the F5?  Thanks in advance!
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:gui-talk-
>> bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf Of Chris G
>> Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 7:57 PM
>> To: NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [gui-talk] Voiceover
>>
>> Hi,
>> The screen reader comes on the Mac as a full product.  When you buy a
>> Mac you press COMMAND-F5 to start VoiceOver.
>>
>> You can hear Mikes' podcasts where he demonstrates the screen reader
>> in
>> action.  His latest one shows an multi platform instant messaging
>> client
>> called Adium that works great with VO.
>> You can find the podcasts at www.blindcooltech.com
>> Those were the reasons I decided to purchase a Mac and I like it.  I
>> didn't find it hard to use after listening to Mike.  The hardest  
>> thing
>> for me was cursor movement, but once I was able to rap my head around
>> the way the Mac does it, it's not an issue.
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sat, 25 Jul 2009 19:19:50 -0400
>> "albert griffith" <albertgriffith at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Ray,  I've yet to read the NFB article but I plan to soon.  We'll
>> benefit
>>> from all the access points it should illuminate. Do you know if
>>> Apple is
>>> offering their screen reader as a demo anywhere?
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: gui-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:gui-talk-
>>> bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf Of Ray Foret jr
>>> Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 3:24 PM
>>> To: NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List
>>> Subject: Re: [gui-talk] Voiceover
>>>
>>> Granted, Voice over is well worth serious consideration; but, Kevin,
>> there's
>>>
>>> no need to get unpleasant about it.  The NFB's perspective was
>>> written
>> from
>>> a Windows users point of view because that's what most blind  
>>> computer
>> users
>>> are familiar with.  Like it or not, this is so.  I always hear
>>> Voice Over
>>> users say "You can't compare the Mac to Windows.".  Fair enough.
>>> So, in
>>> that case, why not truly help us Windows users get to know Voice  
>>> Over
>> better
>>>
>>> instead of just criticizing us just because we do what it is human
>>> nature
>> to
>>>
>>> do; compare one thing to another.  I grant you that the Mac is worth
>> serious
>>>
>>> consideration; and, If I wasn't still paying for this lap top, I
>>> would
>>> indeed very seriously look at Voice Over.  Let me give you an
>>> example of
>> how
>>>
>>> Voice Over users can be more helpful.  In the NFB article, it is
>>> stated
>> that
>>>
>>> when you press the space bar to check or uncheck items on a web  
>>> page,
>> Voice
>>> Over does not tell you whether an item is checked or unchecked.  I
>> believe
>>> this is true; however, there is another factor.  The article then
>>> goes on
>> to
>>>
>>> incorrectly state that there is no way without fumbling around, to
>> determine
>>>
>>> whether an item is checked or not.  As I understand it, there is a
>>> special
>>
>>> Voice over key command which is used to check or uncheck items on  
>>> web
>> pages.
>>>
>>> When this key stroke is used, Voice over will tell you at once
>>> whether an
>>> item is checked or unchecked.  Now, it's quite clear to me that the
>>> fellow
>>
>>> reviewing Voice Over for the NFB did not know this fact.  but, I
>>> ask you,
>>> why did not some voice over users help him with the trouble he was
>>> having?
>>
>>> Why did the NFB not seek help from Voice Over users?  Well, I think
>>> I can
>>> answer that one.  He wanted to deal with Voice Over from the stand
>>> point
>> of
>>> a strictly out of the box experience.  IN other words, his logic
>>> was this.
>>
>>> "Let me see what I can learn about Voice Over strictly from the
>>> help and
>>> what ever documentation I can access on my own.".  Fair enough;
>>> but, let's
>>
>>> think a bit.  How many Windows users do you know who rely just on  
>>> the
>> built
>>> in help and what documentation they can read on their own?  Well, I
>>> sure
>>> don't know too many myself.  Most Windows users go to one another
>>> for help
>>
>>> and we help each other.  Why, therefore, did the NFB fellow not
>>> seek help
>> in
>>>
>>> the same way from Mac users?  A fair question I think.  Frankly, I  
>>> am
>>> perfectly willing to take a look at Voice over, not so much from
>>> the NFB
>>> stand point; nor from a Voice Over defense point of view.  My look
>>> will be
>>
>>> based a bit on both and I will be wanting to get very objective
>> information.
>>>
>>> I don't think I can count on either the NFB or Voice Over devotees
>>> to be
>>> truly objective; and, therefore, the best strategy I can think of
>>> is to
>> take
>>>
>>> the best of both and make your own decision.
>>>
>>> Sincerely,
>>> The Constantly BAREFOOTED Ray
>>>
>>> "Old friend, what are you looking for?  After those many years
>>> abroad you
>>> come With images you tended Under foreign skies Far away from your
>>> own
>> land"
>>> George Seferis
>>>
>>> Phone or Fax::
>>> +1 (985) 360-3614
>>> Cell:
>>> +1 (985) 791-2938
>>> e-mail:
>>> rforetjratcomcastdotnet
>>> Skype Name:
>>> barefootedray
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Kevin Fjelsted" <kfjelsted at gmail.com>
>>> To: "NFBnet GUI Talk Mailing List" <gui-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, July 25, 2009 12:49 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [gui-talk] Voiceover
>>>
>>>
>>> VoiceOver is absolutely awesome. A superb resource for reading
>>> details
>>> from a community perspective is http://www.lioncourt.com.
>>> I thhink that the exciting thing about VoiceOver is that the stars
>>> are
>>> aligned for us. 1) Apple is making record profits and is applying
>>> resources in support of  VoiceOver access across there entire  
>>> product
>>> line including mobile devices. The fact that the NFB technology
>>> center
>>> chooses to publish inaccuracies and propaganda
>>> which is so misleading must mean that the existing companies like
>>> Freedom Scientific are running scared and trying to rally resources
>>> to
>>> quash VoiceOver usage. When ever we see established organizations
>>> becoming defensive it is time to really dig under the covers and ask
>>> the reasons why. In my opinion every blind person who relies on
>>> accessibility technology for computers and mobile devices needs to
>>> look at VoiceOver as well as the other technologies and proactively
>>> push the envelope so that we can create momentum for transparency.  
>>> My
>>> question is, why aren't  all of the vendors  emulating the approach
>>> of
>>> VoiceOver, which is to have built in accessibility to the device out
>>> of the box without charging extra? WHen I can pay $190 for a cell
>>> phone that has built in accessibility I find that amazing compared  
>>> to
>>> spending money for a cell phone and then having to turn around and
>>> buy
>>> a 3rd party access solution that in many cases only works half  
>>> baked.
>>> Not only do I get a cell phone for $190 but I get all the built in
>>> apps talking clock, calculator, maps, weather forecasting, text
>>> messaging, address book management, calendaring including syncing
>>> with
>>> other calendars. For years blind people have taken the position that
>>> touch screens are the enemy and that we can't use them. Yet the
>>> IPhone
>>> with VoiceOver is totally dependent on the touch screen. I do
>>> everything with the touch screen look at email, update my calendar,
>>> make phone calls,....   -Kevin Sat, Jul 25, 2009 at 10:26 AM,
>>> tunecollector<tunecollector at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>> This subject was discussed when Voiceover first came out but has
>>>> anyone
>>>> used
>>>> it more intensively since then? Is it ready for prime time? What
>>>> are its
>>>> drawbacks.
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> gui-talk mailing list
>>>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for
>>>> gui-talk:
>>>>
>>>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/kfjelsted%40gmail
>> .
>>> com
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> Kevin Fjelsted
>>> B Harris, Inc.
>>> http://www.bharrisinc.com
>>> kevin.fjelsted at bharrisinc.com
>>> http://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinfjelsted
>>> Phone:   612.424.7333 EX. 301
>>> Direct:  612.424.7332
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> gui-talk mailing list
>>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
>>> for
>>> gui-talk:
>>>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/rforetjr%40comcast
>>> .net
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> gui-talk mailing list
>>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
>>> for
>>> gui-talk:
>>>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/albertgriffith%40s
>>> bcglobal.net
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> gui-talk mailing list
>>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
>>> for
>> gui-talk:
>>>
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/chris%40mysticplac
>> e.org
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> The home of the Mystic Place blog and podcast.
>> www.mysticplace.info
>> RSS: feeds.feedburner.com/mysticplacebp
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> gui-talk mailing list
>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> gui-talk:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/albertgriffith%40s
>> bcglobal.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> gui-talk mailing list
>> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for gui-talk:
>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/n0oxy%40charter.ne
> t
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> gui-talk mailing list
> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> gui-talk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/albertgriffith%40s
> bcglobal.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> gui-talk mailing list
> gui-talk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/gui-talk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info  
> for gui-talk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/gui-talk_nfbnet.org/n0oxy%40charter.net

More information about the GUI-Talk mailing list