[Dtb-talk] No $330.00 player for me,

Mon Nov 26 12:27:05 CST 2007

Pardon me can I only inquire as to the relationship between the dialogue
here and the subject lines?  
about  

###
BRETT WINCHESTER
bwinchester at icbvi.idaho.gov 
208-639-8386
###

-----Original Message-----
From: dtb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:dtb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
On Behalf Of David B Andrews
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 9:59 AM
To: dtb-talk at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [Dtb-talk] No $330.00 player for me,

Telecommunications devices, which I mentioned, are covered in Section
255 of the Rehab Act.

The ADA does not require a business to fundamentally change its products
or services, so getting them to make devices completely accessible that
way would be a hard sell.  

As we age they may come to it more easily ... time will tell.

Dave

David Andrews
Chief Technology Officer
Minnesota State Services for the Blind
2200 University Ave. W., #240
St. Paul, MN  55114-1840
(651) 642-0513  Office
(612) 730-7931  Cell
(651) 649-5927  Fax

>>> vlewis at suffolk.lib.ny.us 11/26/2007 10:14 AM >>>
Telecommunication devices. 

Additionally, whether or not the law specifically states such and such
device. The notion of the ADA is that people with disabilities should
have the same access as everyone else. 

Valerie

-----Original Message-----
From: dtb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
[mailto:dtb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of David B Andrews
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 10:59 AM
To: dtb-talk at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [Dtb-talk] No $330.00 player for me,

There is no law that says that consumer electronics products have to be
accessible.  There are rules for cell phones, but not other devices.

Dave

David Andrews
Chief Technology Officer
Minnesota State Services for the Blind
2200 University Ave. W., #240
St. Paul, MN  55114-1840
(651) 642-0513  Office
(612) 730-7931  Cell
(651) 649-5927  Fax

>>> vlewis at suffolk.lib.ny.us 11/26/2007 9:07 AM >>>
Hello All, 

The problem is not whether or not companies will have access to the NLS
collection. The problem is whether or not all of these companies will
stop breaking the law and begin to make products that are accessible to
all. All of these companies have the ability to produce accessible
products.
They
choose not to. This forces people with disabilities to seek alternaitve
and most times inferior options. 

Valerie

-----Original Message-----
From: dtb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
[mailto:dtb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Steve Jacobson
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 9:27 AM
To: Discussion of Digital Talking Books; Lynn Evans
Subject: Re: [Dtb-talk] No $330.00 player for me,

Greg,

Aren't we getting the cart ahead of the horse here?  We don't really
know what policy there is for providing access to decrypting NLS books,
if one has even been completely established yet.  Do you know for
certain that apple is ready to make the I Pod completely accessible and
also read NLS books if they only received the go-ahead from NLS?  There
is way too much speculation to start talking about going to congress, or
even to get all upset about since we really don't know what policies
exist and whether Apple or any other manufacturer is even interested at
this point.  Certainly we have seen firmware updates to the I Pod that
make it more accessible, and presumably such an update could be written
to play NLS books, but even that gets dangerously close to software
rather than hardware.  In short, unless you or others have information
that has not been published here that I have seen, we really don't know
enough yet to make the sorts of statements that are being made.  

>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Greg Kearney" <gkearney at gmail.com>
>To: "Discussion of Digital Talking Books" <dtb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>Cc: "Mary Beth Janes" <mjanes at apple.com>
>Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 3:53 AM
>Subject: Re: [Dtb-talk] No $330.00 player for me,

>: Interesting. I suspect that policy, if it is the case, could
run
into
>: some serious problems. It is one thing to say that you will not
>: support software players due to security concerns. It is quite
another
>: to say you will not authorize a given hardware device due to
the
fact
>: that too many people might own one. Thus maintaing high
hardware
costs
>: and a monopoly of manufacturers in perpetuity.
>:
>: I suspect congress, and the California delegation in
particular,
would
>: not look kindly on such an approach. Perhaps it is time to let
some
>: members of congress know. Perhaps a bill instructing the NLS to
>: authorize all manufactures of devices access to the needed keys
is in
>: order to prevent them from picking and choosing who they will
permit
>: to profit from the sale of such devices is needed.
>:
>: I think the NLS need to decide here. Either only they build the
>: players and permit no one else to have the keys or the means to
>: authorize any players. Or they permit anyone, including mass
market
>: makers like Apple to build players and they then give them the
needed
>: information to authorizes such players for NLS patrons. Given
that
>: they have already decided to do the latter I do not see how
they
can
>: tell others that such options are not open to them.
>:
>: Greg Kearney
>: 535 S. Jackson St.
>: Casper, Wyoming 82601
>: 307-224-4022
>: gkearney at gmail.com 
>:
>:
>:
>: On Nov 25, 2007, at 10:23 PM, Wes Derby wrote:
>:
>: > Hello.
>: >
>: > I've been a lurker here for a while, but thought I'd throw in
my two
>: > cents
>: > on this one.
>: >
>: > Having spoken to someone from NLS during a conference a few
months
>: > back, I
>: > think Dan's statement is pretty accurate.  I inquired as to
whether
>: > the
>: > notetakers with on-board media players, such as the PACMate
and
>: > BrailleNote,
>: > might eventually be given the necessary rights and keys to
support
>: > the NLS
>: > digital talking books.  the person I spoke to admitted he
wasn't
>: > sure what a
>: > PACMate or BrailleNote was, but said that they do in fact
want
to
>: > limit
>: > distribution to manufacturers/products that are primarily
used
by NLS
>: > patrons.  This was as of last June, anyway...So don't expect
to see
>: > support
>: > for NLS books on an iPod or any other commercial device any
time in
>: > the
>: > near, or probably distant, future.
>: >
>: >
>: > ---
>: > Visit me on Myspace:
>: > http://www.myspace.com/wesderby 
>: > Now, I actually remember to log in and check it!
>: >
>: > Check out CashCrate:
http://www.cashcrate.com/index.php?ref=230383 
>: > It's free to join, and a great way to earn a few extra bucks.
>: >
>: >
>: > ----- Original Message -----
>: > From: "Dan Rossi" <dr25 at andrew.cmu.edu>
>: > To: "Discussion of Digital Talking Books"
<dtb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>: > Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 7:53 AM
>: > Subject: Re: [Dtb-talk] No $330.00 player for me,
>: >
>: >
>: >> I don't think the issue is a hardware manufacturer being
able
to do a
>: >> firmware upgrade to a mainstream player to support NLS
books.
 I
>: >> think the
>: >> issue is the NLS wanting to play it pretty careful on just
who gets
>: >> licensed to support their books.
>: >>
>: >> The scenario I can cook up in my own active imagination is
that NLS
>: >> is
>: >> pretty sure there isn't going to be a rush of sighted folks
>: >> purchasing
>: >> something like the Stream and then attempting to download
NLS
books
>: >> illegally.  However, if a number of mainstream products
supported NLS
>: >> books, there would be more incentive for non-NLS users to
attempt
>: >> to get
>: >> their hands on NLS books.  Thus, the fewer products
supporting the
>: >> NLS
>: >> format, the smaller the incentive for illegally obtaining
their
>: >> books.  A
>: >> bit of security through obscurity.  Not a great plan, but it
works,
>: >> and I
>: >> see it pretty often in the I.T. industry in general.
>: >>
>: >> -- 
>: >> Blue skies.
>: >> Dan Rossi
>: >> Carnegie Mellon University.
>: >> E-Mail: dr25 at andrew.cmu.edu 
>: >> Tel: (412) 268-9081
>: >> _______________________________________________
>: >> Dtb-talk mailing list
>: >> Dtb-talk at nfbnet.org 
>: >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/dtb-talk 
>: >>
>: >
>: >
>: > _______________________________________________
>: > Dtb-talk mailing list
>: > Dtb-talk at nfbnet.org 
>: > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/dtb-talk 
>:
>: _______________________________________________
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>:
>:
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Date:

>11/25/2007 4:24 PM
>:
>: 

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