[blindlaw] New Scanning Option

Mon Jan 7 08:51:46 CST 2008

I think that terminology may be clouding the issue here.

It is my understanding that currently there are no programs that will
convert files that are purely "image, i.e. no readable text in the file --
files that look like pictures.  Indeed, on these type of documents using
adobe 8.1 to convert the document returns a result of "empty document." It
is my understanding that only files with embedded text can be converted by
any program currently available. 

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of McCarthy, Jim
Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 5:38 AM
To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] New Scanning Option

Well, because I hope Ronza is right, and because I respect her acumen, I
tried to look into this a bit.  I have JAWS version 9 and the latest
adobe reader 8.1 or whatever.  First, I looked in the JAWS help file
under acrobat but there was no mention that later versions of the reader
would offer to convert image files.  Arguably it would be adobe and not
JAWS that would advertise this feature so I thought I would open an
image file that I have not been able to read without running it through
K1000 first.  I was not offered a conversion option by adobe.  I loaded
the adobe software before updating JAWS and I suppose that might make a
difference.  I also wonder if you, Ronza are using the adobe free
software or if you actually own the acrobat professional product?
Perhaps you said and I missed it.  At any rate, what Tim has mentioned
would be a great benefit to many of us I am sure, but perhaps one needs
the professional product to gain that advantage.
Jim McCarthy

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org]
On Behalf Of AZNOR99 at aol.com
Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2008 5:29 PM
To: blindlaw at nfbnet.org
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] New Scanning Option

Steve,
Are you using Jaws 8 or 9?  I believe that's a requirement.  Jaws  7 and
below does not convert the document.  The prompt says something like
"This document appears to be an image.  Would you like Adobe to run a
character scan to convert the image to text?"

I checked a box that tells Adobe to automatically convert all image
files  to text, so I can't get the exact language of the prompt anymore.
Good  luck.

Regards,
Ronza

In a message dated 1/6/2008 4:14:46 P.M. Central Standard Time,
steve.jacobson at visi.com writes:

Please  explain this further because I think we're talking about two
different things  in this thread.  The ability to create PDF documents
that contains  both the original image and the text has been around for
a while.  I do  not know of Acrobat supported it or not but it was an
option at least in  OmniPage when used to create PDF's.  

I just tried to read a  document that was only an image a week ago or so
with Acrobat Reader  8.1.1.  There was no option to extract text from
the document that I  was aware of, but I was able to convert the
document to text using an OmniPage option so I know the text was
recognizable.  This would be  very handy if Adobe built in such a
feature, though.  Would you  describe where you were prompted for the
conversion option?  Are you  certain you were not hearing the "document
being processed" message that  accompanies the normal extraction of
text?  Maybe I missed something.

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

On Sun, 6 Jan  2008 11:15:07 -0800, Russell J. Thomas, Jr. wrote:

>The version you  want is Adobe 8.1. you can download it from the Adobe 
>website.

>The advantage is that this program will convert certain PDF  documents 
>to text, documents which cannot be converted by the use of  other 
>programs.  The disadvantage is that the document must be  saved as a 
>text file, thereby losing the formatting of the original  document.

>-----Original Message-----
>From:  blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org]

>On Behalf Of Ford, Tim (CDPH-OLS)
>Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2008  11:01 AM
>To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
>Subject: Re:  [blindlaw] New Scanning Option

>I have not experienced what you  describe on my free Adobe Reader 
>software, which is version 8  something.  If the material is image 
>only, then JAWS indicates  that, but Adobe does not give me the option 
>of converting to  text.  Perhaps there is some setting in the Adobe 
>Reader software  that needs to be turned on in order to get the prompt

>you describe?  This would be wonderful news.  While the  virtual 
>Freedom Import printer works well enough, converting through  Openbook,

>this new approach sounds even better, and especially for  large 
>documents, where converting through Openbook can take  awhile.  So if 
>you happen to know how to activate this feature,  please let me know.

>Tim Ford
> 

>-----Original  Message-----
>From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org  [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>On Behalf Of  AZNOR99 at aol.com
>Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2008 10:53 AM
>To:  blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>Subject: Re: [blindlaw] New Scanning  Option

>Tim and All,
> 
>I noticed this a few months  ago.  The newer versions of Adobe (8.0 and
>above) now have a  feature that recognizes screen reading software, in 
>my experience Jaws  8.0 and beyond.  Once I download an image file, 
>Adobe recognizes  that there is text and asks if I want it to try to 
>convert the  file  to OCR-enabled.  Once I do, it very quickly 
>processes  the image and  converts it.  I've done this with briefs,  
>receipts, and even exhibits.  In fact, I've not used my virtual  
>printer once since I upgraded  to the new version of  Adobe.
> 
>This means that you don't necessarily need Adobe  Professional on any 
>machine.  The standard free addition works  wonderfully.  It's made my 
>work much easier and saved me a great  deal of time.
> 
>Regards,
>Ronza
> 
> 
>  
>In a message dated 1/6/2008 12:46:02 P.M. Central Standard  Time, 
>Tim.Ford at cdph.ca.gov writes:

>I  recently  discovered, quite by accident, a new scanning option that
>may be   of interest.

>My office recently installed Adobe Acrobat 8  Professional,  Version 
>8.0.0, on the computer with the scanner  that I have been using to 
>create PDF versions of briefs an other  material I need to send to 
>others electronically.  I had my  assistant scan in a brief that I was
>to file electronically.   

>I pulled up the results, just   to print it and have my  assistant make
>sure all the pages were there.   To my  surprise, JAWS started
>automatically reading the document.   I  had my assistant check, and on
>the screen, and what we printed,  was the  typical image only format, 
>with my scrawled signature and  all.

>so  apparently what this new version of Adobe has is the  capacity to 
>add a  quite good optical character recognition of the  text.  The 
>recognition quality was quite good, better than what I  am used to with

>OpenBook.

>So the advantages of this  is that:

>1.  You  have a PDF file with the actual intact  original, so if there 
>are any scan  errors to figure out, you have  the original there for a
>sighted person to  review.   

>2.  You also have the actual original that you can   print and/or send
>electronically to others.  If the person you  send it  to does not use 
>a screen reading program, then they will  not notice any  difference 
>between what they see and any other  Adobe PDF image only  scan.

>3.  If the recipient  has a screen reader installed,  then Adobe knows
>that, and  automatically turns on the converted text   imbedded
>information.

>Oh yes, and there is yet another  neat  aspect.  Although the Adobe 
>text conversion itself is  not something  you can edit, all you do is 
>select whatever text  you want, including using  control plus a to
select all,
>and paste  that in to a Word document.   That gives you everything
that
>the Adobe text recognition picked  up.

>For my  Adobe reader software, I have the typical free reader  version,
>so  you do not need to have the Adobe Professional version   installed
>except on the machine that has the scanner on  it.

>I do not  know the cost of the Adobe Professional version  software.
>However, this is  the typical software product that most  offices now 
>use, and is certainly  something that would be  affordable by most any
>office of any   size.

>Sincerely,
>Tim   Ford
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